Just wanted to remind everyone it's illegal to import any electronic devices into Europe without them having a CE mark. I see there have been many projects like the Jackson Labs unit that have been imported into Europe. This is illegal. I don't mean to knick pick, but it costs our company about $10000 to CE mark a product. And if we add one small option, it must be CE marked again. To the small manufacturer, this kills us and doesn't allow us to offer low prices. Steve Best Regards Martyn This Email is from: Martyn Smith Precision Test Systems LTD Tel: +44 (0) 1245 329608 Email: martyn@ptsyst.com Web: www.ptsyst.com NOTICE - This message contains legally privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the addressee named above. If you are not the intended recipient of this message, you are hereby notified that you must not disseminate, distribute, copy or take any action in reliance on it. If you have received this message in error, please notify Precision Test Systems LTD. This communication represents the originator's personal views and opinions, which do not necessarily reflect those of Precision Test Systems Ltd. from whom it emanates. Further, Precision Test Systems Ltd. will not be held responsible for its contents and/or attachments, if the communication contravenes the rules of Precision Test Systems Ltd's email policy. ----- Original Message ----- From: <time-nuts-request@febo.com> To: <time-nuts@febo.com> Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 1:17 AM Subject: time-nuts Digest, Vol 49, Issue 32 > Send time-nuts mailing list submissions to > time-nuts@febo.com > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > time-nuts-request@febo.com > > You can reach the person managing the list at > time-nuts-owner@febo.com > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of time-nuts digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. New 10mhz Distribution Amplifier (Doug Millar) > 2. Re: New 10mhz Distribution Amplifier (Bruce Griffiths) > 3. Datum FTS-4040A Cesium standard (S. Nestra) > 4. Re: New 10mhz Distribution Amplifier (Rick Karlquist) > 5. Re: New 10mhz Distribution Amplifier (Bruce Griffiths) > 6. Re: New 10mhz Distribution Amplifier (Rick Karlquist) > 7. Re: I want a good micro-controller (Robert Vassar) > 8. Re: I want a good micro-controller (Bruce Griffiths) > 9. Re: New 10mhz Distribution Amplifier (Magnus Danielson) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 10:26:01 -0700 > From: Doug Millar <dougnhelen@moonlink.net> > Subject: [time-nuts] New 10mhz Distribution Amplifier > To: <time-nuts@febo.com> > Message-ID: <0K5L00L28PRHNVZ4@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed > > > Hi, > A new 10mhz distribution amplifier is available at amateur prices. > Jerry N7EME is producing them. His website is at > http://jwmeng.com/model_RDA-6.html > Doug K6JEY > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 09:52:29 +1200 > From: Bruce Griffiths <bruce.griffiths@xtra.co.nz> > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] New 10mhz Distribution Amplifier > To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement > <time-nuts@febo.com> > Message-ID: <48A4A91D.3050806@xtra.co.nz> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Doug Millar wrote: >> Hi, >> A new 10mhz distribution amplifier is available at amateur prices. >> Jerry N7EME is producing them. His website is at >> http://jwmeng.com/model_RDA-6.html >> Doug K6JEY >> >> >> > There's a few specifications missing: > > 1) input impedance and return loss. > > 2) output impedance and return loss > > 3) phase noise > > These are essential if one is to make a rational decision on the > suitability of the distribution amplifier. > > The outputs and inputs appear to share a common ground. > This would preclude its use in some setups without external means of > providing the required isolation. > > The other question is does the device use AGC to set the output level? > If it does the phase noise floor will almost inevitably be relatively > high compared to the state of the art. > > Bruce > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 00:24:55 +0200 > From: "S. Nestra" <pe1rks@xs4all.nl> > Subject: [time-nuts] Datum FTS-4040A Cesium standard > To: time-nuts@febo.com > Message-ID: <48A4B0B7.8050206@xs4all.nl> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Hi, > > I have a problem with a FTS-4040A standard, the LED major fault stays on > forever. > When I use the monitor program from Symmetricom I see that my OCXO stays > cold and I have no Cesium oven voltage. The OCXO does feel warm so this > one is warming up, I don't know if the cesium oven is warming up since I > can't feel any heat from the CBT. > I also don't see any current from the ION pump. > After opening the unit I found a burnt resistor R1 on one board, I don't > know what it's function is but I would like to know the value of this > resistor so I can replace it. > So here is my question: does anybody have any technical documentation > for this unit and is it possible for someone to lookup this resistor in > his standard so I know the value( pictures included for position). > I think I have a power supply problem. > I welcome all suggestions. > > Greets, > > Stijn Nestra > > Link for the pictures and the list of > faults: http://82.95.123.226/fts4040a/ > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 15:37:11 -0700 (PDT) > From: "Rick Karlquist" <richard@karlquist.com> > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] New 10mhz Distribution Amplifier > To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" > <time-nuts@febo.com> > Message-ID: > <16702.192.25.142.225.1218753431.squirrel@webmail.sonic.net> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 > > Additional specs to consider: > > The return loss should be low for 10 MHz and the first 8 harmonics. > The harmonic distortion should be low. > The isolation between outputs should be high. > The phase drift vs temperature should be low. > The short term stability at 1 second should be good. > The magnetic field susceptibility should be low. > Line sidebands should be low. > > Compare, for example, the HP5087, a so-so design, to the > output amplifier design in the 5071A cesium, as documented > in my FCS paper in 1992. Huge difference in specs. The > 5071A has 120 dB isolation between outputs. > > Rick Karlquist N6RK > > > Bruce Griffiths wrote: >> Doug Millar wrote: >>> Hi, >>> A new 10mhz distribution amplifier is available at amateur prices. >>> Jerry N7EME is producing them. His website is at >>> http://jwmeng.com/model_RDA-6.html >>> Doug K6JEY >>> >>> >>> >> There's a few specifications missing: >> >> 1) input impedance and return loss. >> >> 2) output impedance and return loss >> >> 3) phase noise >> >> These are essential if one is to make a rational decision on the >> suitability of the distribution amplifier. >> >> The outputs and inputs appear to share a common ground. >> This would preclude its use in some setups without external means of >> providing the required isolation. >> >> The other question is does the device use AGC to set the output level? >> If it does the phase noise floor will almost inevitably be relatively >> high compared to the state of the art. >> >> Bruce >> >> _______________________________________________ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to >> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. >> >> > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 10:46:07 +1200 > From: Bruce Griffiths <bruce.griffiths@xtra.co.nz> > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] New 10mhz Distribution Amplifier > To: richard@karlquist.com, Discussion of precise time and frequency > measurement <time-nuts@febo.com> > Message-ID: <48A4B5AF.4030707@xtra.co.nz> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Rick Karlquist wrote: >> Additional specs to consider: >> >> The return loss should be low for 10 MHz and the first 8 harmonics. >> The harmonic distortion should be low. >> The isolation between outputs should be high. >> The phase drift vs temperature should be low. >> The short term stability at 1 second should be good. >> The magnetic field susceptibility should be low. >> Line sidebands should be low. >> >> Compare, for example, the HP5087, a so-so design, to the >> output amplifier design in the 5071A cesium, as documented >> in my FCS paper in 1992. Huge difference in specs. The >> 5071A has 120 dB isolation between outputs. >> >> Rick Karlquist N6RK >> >> >> > Rick > > Did you mean a high return loss or equivalently low reflection > coefficient? > > The layout of the board in the picture is perhaps preliminary the input > signal track to 3 of the output sections is a little too close to > another track. > > Its hard to tell from the low res image but have thick film resistors > been used? > These can have excessive flicker noise thus increasing the close in > phase noise above that possible with thin film resistors. > > Bruce > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 16:13:58 -0700 (PDT) > From: "Rick Karlquist" <richard@karlquist.com> > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] New 10mhz Distribution Amplifier > To: "Bruce Griffiths" <bruce.griffiths@xtra.co.nz> > Cc: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement > <time-nuts@febo.com> > Message-ID: > <7609.192.25.142.225.1218755638.squirrel@webmail.sonic.net> >Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 > > I should have said the return loss should be "high" or "good" :-) > > Bruce Griffiths wrote: >> Rick Karlquist wrote: >>> Additional specs to consider: >>> >>> The return loss should be low for 10 MHz and the first 8 harmonics. >>> The harmonic distortion should be low. >>> The isolation between outputs should be high. >>> The phase drift vs temperature should be low. >>> The short term stability at 1 second should be good. >>> The magnetic field susceptibility should be low. >>> Line sidebands should be low. >>> >>> Compare, for example, the HP5087, a so-so design, to the >>> output amplifier design in the 5071A cesium, as documented >>> in my FCS paper in 1992. Huge difference in specs. The >>> 5071A has 120 dB isolation between outputs. >>> >>> Rick Karlquist N6RK >>> >>> >>> >> Rick >> >> Did you mean a high return loss or equivalently low reflection >> coefficient? >> >> The layout of the board in the picture is perhaps preliminary the input >> signal track to 3 of the output sections is a little too close to >> another track. >> >> Its hard to tell from the low res image but have thick film resistors >> been used? >> These can have excessive flicker noise thus increasing the close in >> phase noise above that possible with thin film resistors. >> >> Bruce >> >> > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 18:24:46 -0500 > From: Robert Vassar <rvassar@rob-vassar.com> > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] I want a good micro-controller > To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement > <time-nuts@febo.com> > Message-ID: <B8B0DEA1-C95B-4E11-BEA9-7A8BD33193B5@rob-vassar.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes; > format=flowed > > > > > Good grief! That's not a microcontroller! :-) > > > > I like the MCS-51 family, but they're kind of goofy to program in C, > and 8-bit. Upside, lots of vendors & variants, including the really > nice SiLabs mixed signal chips made here in Austin. AVR is much > nicer to code in C, and has great tool support, but they're single > source, and I have read that Atmel is not always completely > forthcoming in their errata. > > > Arm... If you need something that can run Linux.... But why not just > go for a Soekris board at that point? :-) > > > Rob > KC6OOM/5 > > > On Aug 13, 2008, at 7:06 PM, Bob Paddock wrote: > >>> any ARM7 outperforms the best PIC in price and performance :) >> >> http://beagleboard.org/ >> >> Get them from DigiKey, $149. >> >> http://dkc1.digikey.com/us/mkt/beagleboard.html >> >> "The USB-powered Beagle Board is a low-cost, fan-less single board >> >> computer utilizing Texas Instruments' OMAP3530 [ARM] application >> processor >> >> that unleashes laptop-like performance and >> >> expansion without the bulk, expense, or noise of typical desktop >> machines. >> >> Beagle Board is based on an OMAP3530 application processor featuring >> an ARM(R) Cortex?-A8 running at up to 600MHz and delivering over 1,200 >> Dhrystone MIPS of performance via superscalar operation with highly >> accurate branch prediction and 256KB of L2 cache. Focal to Beagle >> Board experience is the high-speed USB 2.0 on-the-go (OTG) port that >> can be utilized to provide power to the board or to deliver highly >> flexible expansion. Standard PC peripherals can be connected to >> Beagle Board using the USB with a mini-A to standard-A cable adapter, >> DVI-D using an HDMI to DVI-D adapter, or through the MMC/SD/SDIO >> connector enabling a complete desktop experience." >> >> >> -- >> http://www.wearablesmartsensors.com/ >> http://www.softwaresafety.net/ >> http://www.designer-iii.com/ >> http://www.unusualresearch.com/ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ >> time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 11:44:50 +1200 > From: Bruce Griffiths <bruce.griffiths@xtra.co.nz> > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] I want a good micro-controller > To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement > <time-nuts@febo.com> > Message-ID: <48A4C372.7090104@xtra.co.nz> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed > > Robert Vassar wrote: >> >> Good grief! That's not a microcontroller! :-) >> >> >> >> I like the MCS-51 family, but they're kind of goofy to program in C, >> and 8-bit. Upside, lots of vendors & variants, including the really >> nice SiLabs mixed signal chips made here in Austin. AVR is much >> nicer to code in C, and has great tool support, but they're single >> source, and I have read that Atmel is not always completely >> forthcoming in their errata. >> >> >> Arm... If you need something that can run Linux.... But why not just >> go for a Soekris board at that point? :-) >> >> >> Rob >> KC6OOM/5 >> >> > You can do substantially better by using a suitable FPGA board. > One can create a hardware timestamp counter with multiple capture > registers that wont wrap around in less than a week or more together > with whatever simple processors required for decoding GPS receiver data. > A simple 16 x2 character LCD display or similar is easily added for > field readout. Keyboards and pushbuttons together with serial ports USB > ports etc are often provided so communications with A PC for data > retrieval /storage is readily possible. > > Bruce > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 9 > Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 02:17:21 +0200 > From: Magnus Danielson <magnus@rubidium.dyndns.org> > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] New 10mhz Distribution Amplifier > To: richard@karlquist.com, Discussion of precise time and frequency > measurement <time-nuts@febo.com> > Message-ID: <48A4CB11.3080004@rubidium.dyndns.org> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Rick Karlquist wrote: >> I should have said the return loss should be "high" or "good" :-) > > "high" works, "good" depends on the application. :-) > > I would look at the return loss curve in general. > > Cheers, > Magnus > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list > time-nuts@febo.com > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > > End of time-nuts Digest, Vol 49, Issue 32 > ***************************************** >

In message <63593424D48240B7ADB6FAED64ECD187@MartynDesktop>, "Martyn Smith" wri tes: >Just wanted to remind everyone it's illegal to import any electronic devices >into Europe without them having a CE mark. That is not true. It is illegal to *sell* things without CE marks to the unwashed public, but you are allowed to import for personal use. In addition there are a vast array of exemptions, including professional test & measurement equipment. Furthermore, anything constructed before the CE mark requirement came into force in their local country are OK. >I see there have been many projects like the Jackson Labs unit that have >been imported into Europe. This is illegal. No, it is not, stop spreading FUD. Poul-Henning -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence.

Martyn Smith wrote: > I don't mean to knick pick, but ... > I assume you didn't mean to nitpick either. Sorry. Not really important. I know it's bad form to criticize grammar on the internet but it caught my attention. Don't get me started on there, their and they're.

My pet hate is loose and lose. And there are many sufferers on this forum too... But no names! :-) Jim 2008/8/15 Rex <rexa@sonic.net> > Martyn Smith wrote: > > I don't mean to knick pick, but ... > > > > I assume you didn't mean to nitpick either. > > Sorry. Not really important. I know it's bad form to criticize grammar > on the internet but it caught my attention. Don't get me started on > there, their and they're. > > > > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. >

Jim Palfreyman wrote: > My pet hate is loose and lose. > Perhaps we could form a chapter of the AAAA? http://www.worldwidewords.org/articles/apostrophe.htm Dave (G0DJA)

It depends on local interpretations of the CE rules. UK as usual in all things emanating from the EU does it all to the letter, so yes, it is illegal here (may be a bit more relaxed up your way Poul, as common sense and EU don't seem to mix down here!). One can get exceptions in a few cases, especially if military customers are involved. But, the general rule is that if it hasn't got a CE mark in the UK you can't sell it. Rob Kimberley -----Original Message----- From: time-nuts-bounces@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-bounces@febo.com] On Behalf Of Poul-Henning Kamp Sent: 15 August 2008 09:49 To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Importing into EEC In message <63593424D48240B7ADB6FAED64ECD187@MartynDesktop>, "Martyn Smith" wri tes: >Just wanted to remind everyone it's illegal to import any electronic >devices into Europe without them having a CE mark. That is not true. It is illegal to *sell* things without CE marks to the unwashed public, but you are allowed to import for personal use. In addition there are a vast array of exemptions, including professional test & measurement equipment. Furthermore, anything constructed before the CE mark requirement came into force in their local country are OK. >I see there have been many projects like the Jackson Labs unit that >have been imported into Europe. This is illegal. No, it is not, stop spreading FUD. Poul-Henning -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. _______________________________________________ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.

Avian branch of the Apostrophe Police: http://www.xertech.net/pub/puncbird2.jpg -Rex David Ackrill wrote: > Jim Palfreyman wrote: > >> My pet hate is loose and lose. >> >> > > Perhaps we could form a chapter of the AAAA? > > http://www.worldwidewords.org/articles/apostrophe.htm > > Dave (G0DJA) > > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > > >