TWL: Flipping the anchor chain?
On our recent trip north we met some very nice people on a new 52 Defever
(I added this one to my dream boat list) who used to have a 44 Defever like
ours. In the course of the discussion on design features, etc. they asked
what we did when we flipped our anchor chain over on it's self in the
anchor locker. We told them that had never happened to us and we had never
heard of it before. They explained that on their trips up and down the west
coast in their 44 Defever they been in seas that had the bow moving up and
down enough to cause the anchor chain to lift up and fall down on it's
side, burying the top of the chain. The only way to deploy the anchor after
this happens is to open the chain locker and pull the chain out by hand
until the top of the chain is free. They had this happened often enough
that they asked Art Defever about it when they had their new boat built and
they put a large cone (pointy end up) in the anchor locker so the chain
would not create a pile that could fall over.
Anyone ever hear of this before? Anyone ever had this happen to you and if
so, what kind of seas did it take?
Frank Osborne & Linda Penwarden
Island Fever, 44 Defever
Anacortes, WA
I had this happen on my old 41' Mainship a few years ago. The trip from
LA to San Francisco was pretty bumpy and by the time we got home the
chain was so tightly compacted on top of itself that we couldn't remove
it from the chain locker . We ended up having to cut it into pieces and
replace the chain.
Very expensive.... Hope you find an easier way to avoid the problem in
the first place.
On Fri, 25 Jul 2003, Frank Osborne wrote:
Anyone ever hear of this before? Anyone ever had this happen to you and
if so, what kind of seas did it take?
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In a rough (needlessly) 19hour passage from the Dry Tortugas to SW Florida
in 6 to 7 foot waves ( 12 to 14 feet top to bottom) our Defever buried the
bow and took green water around the porteguese bridge on every other wave.
It was after midnight when we reached a secure anchorage to discover that
the chain had become a tangled ball. It took half an hour to break out a
second anchor and it's rode to settle down for the night. It only took all
the next morning to untangle the chain ball a few inches at a time.
When our old Nielson windlass gives up, we will replace it with a reversing
windlass to pull the chain ball apart more easily.
Tom Little
Defever 49PH Kalani
<snip> They explained that on their trips up and down the west
coast in their 44 Defever they been in seas that had the bow moving up and
down enough to cause the anchor chain to lift up and fall down on it's
side, burying the top of the chain. The only way to deploy the anchor after
this happens is to open the chain locker and pull the chain out by hand
until the top of the chain is free.
Anyone ever hear of this before? Anyone ever had this happen to you and if
so, what kind of seas did it take?<snip>
Hi Frank.
Sure have had this happen to me, on a few occasions.
I have an aft-cabin Universal 41 and do a lot of my boating in Port Phillip,
a bay of some 700 sq. miles.
The catch is that for the most part the bay is around 40 to 60 ft deep, so
that a nasty, short chop is created
in winds above about 25 knots. The waves are about five to eight feet in
these conditions, BUT they're often
"backless", which means that the boat tends to punch over/through, then drop
into the following trough .
It's the drop that leaves the chain in the air momentarily as the boat falls
out from under it.
So, if the chain has formed the usual pyramid, as you have correctly
diagnosed, it falls over on itself and tangles.
Then the untangling is a real problem. Especially if you arrive at an
anchorage in a brisk breeze and cant get your anchor down!!
There are a number of tricks to try to prevent this. The inverted conical
anchor locker is one. Another is a fore and aft divider placed directly
under the fall, so that hopefully, half the chain falls on each side as it's
coming in, or a long sloping large diameter tube (if you have the room) so
that the chain fills it from the bottom up.
I can access the anchor locker easily from the forward cabin, so I leave a
pair of riggers gloves nearby so that I can distribute the chain as it comes
down, whilst my wife operates the anchor winch. This is about the only
failsafe method I know of.
Cheers
Glenn.
"Stirling"
On some boats it can be ignored...those with steep pointy anchor lockers.
Others have the problem. The West Coast brings it on big time. On big
sailboats with the problem it is customary to simply unload the anchor
locker early on long sea legs and repack it neatly and tightly. Great job
for wasting an hour or two when there is nothing better to do. That solves
the problem.
Jim
I can access the anchor locker easily from the forward cabin, so I leave a
pair of riggers gloves nearby so that I can distribute the chain
as it comes
down, whilst my wife operates the anchor winch. This is about the only
failsafe method I know of.
Cheers
Glenn.
"Stirling"
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We had it happen every once in a while on our old Tayana. Our standard
practice was to knock the pile down with a stick while retrieving the
anchor. On our Tayana, we could do this from on deck by putting the stick
down the hawse pipe and knocking the pile over every 50 feet or so. Usually
this kept the tangles small enough that the two way windless could shake
them out easily.
However, once on the west coast of Mexico, the tangle was the size of a
volley ball and completely jammed. The power windless was reeling out the
chain at a fairly good rate when the tangle hit the top of the anchor locker
with a bang that sounded like it would break through the deck. After I
cleaned myself up (G), we took the boat back out and drove in circles while
I went below to the locker and spent a half hour untangling it.
Kent
They explained that on their trips up and down the west
coast in their 44 Defever they been in seas that had the bow moving up and
down enough to cause the anchor chain to lift up and fall down on it's
side, burying the top of the chain. The only way to deploy the anchor
after
this happens is to open the chain locker and pull the chain out by hand
until the top of the chain is free. They had this happened often enough
that they asked Art Defever about it when they had their new boat built
and
they put a large cone (pointy end up) in the anchor locker so the chain
would not create a pile that could fall over.
I've got 220' of 5/16HT chain in the starboard bow chain locker and 125'
in the port bow locker. I've had the boat 12 years and never had the
problems you describe. I put on over 5,000 miles/year, some of it in
pretty nasty seas. Maybe you need to look at other chain types or
center the feed pipe to the chain locker??
Regards.....
Phil Rosch
Old Harbor Consulting
M/V "Curmudgeon" Marine Trader 44 TC
Currently Moored in Block Island, RI
"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you
didn't
do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away
from
the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream.
Discover." - Mark Twain
On Fri, 25 Jul 2003 11:41:59 -0700, Frank Osborne
Frank.Osborne@verizon.net wrote:
On our recent trip north we met some very nice people on a new 52 Defever
(I added this one to my dream boat list) who used to have a 44 Defever like
ours. In the course of the discussion on design features, etc. they asked
what we did when we flipped our anchor chain over on it's self in the
anchor locker.
I have this problem when I have a really good day of sailing
on my Gulfstar sloop. The anchor locker forward of the v-bearth is
un-partitioned and leaves lots of room for monument. I plan to put in
a longitudinal divider to reduce the space available for the anchor
rode to flip over. This may also make room for a second anchor rode.
I have also heard of a solution for flaking the chain back and
forth without sending a crew below when you weigh the anchor. One
attaches a large rubber hose (say 3") to the underside of the deck
where the chain pipe penetrates. A bungee cord pulls the hose in one
direction while a line pulling the opposite direction is routed on
deck for the crew to pull. When weighing anchor the winch operator
"pumps" the line thus wagging the hose back and forth to flake the
chain.
Ross Fleming ross@renoun.net
S/V Renown Gulfstar 39
Seattle, Washington http://renoun.net