GH
gene heskett
Thu, Dec 16, 2021 7:37 PM
On Thursday, December 16, 2021 11:16:17 AM EST nop head wrote:
PP doesn't stick to PEI, most other filaments do. It only sticks to itself
as far as I know.
The glue that comes on the back of the PP film must stick to it, so perhaps
if you coat your bed with that it will stick.
I'm not sure how that 3M film works, its only sticky on one side, stuck to the
plastic coat on the steel sheet, its dead smooth on the other side, and
doesn't say what the film itself is made of. The separate 1mm thick PEI sheet
has a peelable film on both sides, but no glue that I could detect by peeling
a corner of the film loose on both sides.
Maybe I should ask Prusa how to use PolyProp?
A net search shows only advice from Simplify3d, which I don't have, but I've
printed the advice. Seems that packing tape is made from PP, I assume the tan
stuff but I have clear. If I can remember it, I'll get another bed sheet fom
Prusa the next time I have to order something from them. Then I'll cut one of
these 310x310 sheets down to stick on one side of the old one, and cover the
other side in non-overlapping packing tape. Simplify also notes a several
layer (6) raft can be helpful, as is a 45 to 60C heated enclosure.
The reason for the interest in PP is its harder than TPU, while still being
flexible, and might be just the ticket for the loose belt in a 2nd generation
harmonic drive. The solid section at the bottom of the spline could be double
or tripled in thickness, improving its ultimate sheer strength, that while
making the spines longer, should allow a truly bulletproof drive to be made.
The increased axial length is easily adjusted for in the Drives axle pulley
print.
It seems to me that a reduction in axle pulley teeth, currently 83 and an
increase in the drives present output pulley, currently 23, should at some
point result in a tight fitting belt w/o a tensioning idler setup there really
isn't room for w/o enclosing the current output face with a wall to hang the
idler on. There is not such a wall in the current model as that output disk is
nearly full diameter and turns as the output pulley carrier. Another thought
comes to mind, that of making the bearing ball grooves directly in the
eccentric armatures outer surface, and printing the outer race in PP. flex
failure of that race was observed once but another half a mm thicker and it
has not repeated. But that race and the loose belt are the first 2 potential
failure points. Since the motor runs hot, I've slowed it to around 350 rpm,
but its still running since the middle of September, no failure. Output disk
is about 5 seconds a rev.
I use Suave Extreme Hold UnScented in a red spray can.
On 12/16/2021 10:27 AM, gene heskett wrote:
On Thursday, December 16, 2021 10:04:26 AM EST jon wrote:
I use hair spray on my Prusa MK3S print bed both to increase adhesion
and to allow parts to separate (the hair spray is water soluble, so
worst case is that you let the water dissolve the hair spray)
I raided the bathroom collection my departed wife left me with, but
anything that seemed to have adhesive qualities.
Does that stuff die in the can?
Some of it, she didn't seem to have a favorite, must have been 15+ years
On 12/16/2021 9:54 AM, nop head wrote:
I print PC on glass with glue stick to make it stick. I think it is
PETG that needs it more for release as it can stick too well.
Cheers, Gene Heskett.
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
On Thursday, December 16, 2021 11:16:17 AM EST nop head wrote:
> PP doesn't stick to PEI, most other filaments do. It only sticks to itself
> as far as I know.
>
> The glue that comes on the back of the PP film must stick to it, so perhaps
> if you coat your bed with that it will stick.
>
I'm not sure how that 3M film works, its only sticky on one side, stuck to the
plastic coat on the steel sheet, its dead smooth on the other side, and
doesn't say what the film itself is made of. The separate 1mm thick PEI sheet
has a peelable film on both sides, but no glue that I could detect by peeling
a corner of the film loose on both sides.
Maybe I should ask Prusa how to use PolyProp?
A net search shows only advice from Simplify3d, which I don't have, but I've
printed the advice. Seems that packing tape is made from PP, I assume the tan
stuff but I have clear. If I can remember it, I'll get another bed sheet fom
Prusa the next time I have to order something from them. Then I'll cut one of
these 310x310 sheets down to stick on one side of the old one, and cover the
other side in non-overlapping packing tape. Simplify also notes a several
layer (6) raft can be helpful, as is a 45 to 60C heated enclosure.
The reason for the interest in PP is its harder than TPU, while still being
flexible, and might be just the ticket for the loose belt in a 2nd generation
harmonic drive. The solid section at the bottom of the spline could be double
or tripled in thickness, improving its ultimate sheer strength, that while
making the spines longer, should allow a truly bulletproof drive to be made.
The increased axial length is easily adjusted for in the Drives axle pulley
print.
It seems to me that a reduction in axle pulley teeth, currently 83 and an
increase in the drives present output pulley, currently 23, should at some
point result in a tight fitting belt w/o a tensioning idler setup there really
isn't room for w/o enclosing the current output face with a wall to hang the
idler on. There is not such a wall in the current model as that output disk is
nearly full diameter and turns as the output pulley carrier. Another thought
comes to mind, that of making the bearing ball grooves directly in the
eccentric armatures outer surface, and printing the outer race in PP. flex
failure of that race was observed once but another half a mm thicker and it
has not repeated. But that race and the loose belt are the first 2 potential
failure points. Since the motor runs hot, I've slowed it to around 350 rpm,
but its still running since the middle of September, no failure. Output disk
is about 5 seconds a rev.
> On Thu, 16 Dec 2021 at 16:11, jon <jon@jonbondy.com> wrote:
> > I use Suave Extreme Hold UnScented in a red spray can.
> >
> > On 12/16/2021 10:27 AM, gene heskett wrote:
> > > On Thursday, December 16, 2021 10:04:26 AM EST jon wrote:
> > >> I use hair spray on my Prusa MK3S print bed both to increase adhesion
> > >> and to allow parts to separate (the hair spray is water soluble, so
> > >> worst case is that you let the water dissolve the hair spray)
> > >
> > > I raided the bathroom collection my departed wife left me with, but
> >
> > didn't find
> >
> > > anything that seemed to have adhesive qualities.
> > >
> > > Does that stuff die in the can?
> > >
> > > Some of it, she didn't seem to have a favorite, must have been 15+ years
> >
> > old.
> >
> > >> On 12/16/2021 9:54 AM, nop head wrote:
> > >>> I print PC on glass with glue stick to make it stick. I think it is
> > >>> PETG that needs it more for release as it can stick too well.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OpenSCAD mailing list
> > To unsubscribe send an email to discuss-leave@lists.openscad.org
Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
- Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
GH
gene heskett
Thu, Dec 16, 2021 7:49 PM
On Thursday, December 16, 2021 12:11:49 PM EST Rogier Wolff wrote:
On 12/16/2021 10:27 AM, gene heskett wrote:
Some of it, she didn't seem to have a favorite, must have been 15+
years old.
... does it die in the can? ...
I bought stuff that is supposedly rebranded hairspray for 3D printing.
The first bottle I bought seems to have lost effectiveness. I'm on the
second can even though the first can seems to be ejecting something,
and is not yet empty. So my answer: Could be!
Roger.
The local evidence seems to agree. No mixing balls can be heard in 2 cans, and
no shake well instructions are on the cans. With a mixing ball, I'd expect
shake well instructions. Might say aussie in big print, says P&G in the fine
print.
Cheers, Gene Heskett.
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
On Thursday, December 16, 2021 12:11:49 PM EST Rogier Wolff wrote:
> On 12/16/2021 10:27 AM, gene heskett wrote:
> > Some of it, she didn't seem to have a favorite, must have been 15+
> > years old.
> > ... does it die in the can? ...
>
> I bought stuff that is supposedly rebranded hairspray for 3D printing.
>
> The first bottle I bought seems to have lost effectiveness. I'm on the
> second can even though the first can seems to be ejecting something,
> and is not yet empty. So my answer: Could be!
>
> Roger.
The local evidence seems to agree. No mixing balls can be heard in 2 cans, and
no shake well instructions are on the cans. With a mixing ball, I'd expect
shake well instructions. Might say aussie in big print, says P&G in the fine
print.
Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
- Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
RW
Raymond West
Thu, Dec 16, 2021 10:54 PM
Just get the cheapest hairspray you can, and the strongest - you may
have the equivalent of 'the pound shop' . Some folk use a glue stick
(pritt/whatever) I could never get it on smooth enough. A useful chart
wrt properties
https://www.simplify3d.com/support/materials-guide/properties-table/
You realise you can get different stiffness grades of tpu. I bought some
cheap Ziro tpu filament, says it's Shore A 95. E-sun have a tpe with
Shore 83A, but often no information is given (and even if it is, no
guarantee of accuracy, I expect.
On 16/12/2021 19:49, gene heskett wrote:
On Thursday, December 16, 2021 12:11:49 PM EST Rogier Wolff wrote:
On 12/16/2021 10:27 AM, gene heskett wrote:
Some of it, she didn't seem to have a favorite, must have been 15+
years old.
... does it die in the can? ...
I bought stuff that is supposedly rebranded hairspray for 3D printing.
The first bottle I bought seems to have lost effectiveness. I'm on the
second can even though the first can seems to be ejecting something,
and is not yet empty. So my answer: Could be!
Roger.
The local evidence seems to agree. No mixing balls can be heard in 2 cans, and
no shake well instructions are on the cans. With a mixing ball, I'd expect
shake well instructions. Might say aussie in big print, says P&G in the fine
print.
Cheers, Gene Heskett.
Just get the cheapest hairspray you can, and the strongest - you may
have the equivalent of 'the pound shop' . Some folk use a glue stick
(pritt/whatever) I could never get it on smooth enough. A useful chart
wrt properties
https://www.simplify3d.com/support/materials-guide/properties-table/
You realise you can get different stiffness grades of tpu. I bought some
cheap Ziro tpu filament, says it's Shore A 95. E-sun have a tpe with
Shore 83A, but often no information is given (and even if it is, no
guarantee of accuracy, I expect.
On 16/12/2021 19:49, gene heskett wrote:
> On Thursday, December 16, 2021 12:11:49 PM EST Rogier Wolff wrote:
>> On 12/16/2021 10:27 AM, gene heskett wrote:
>>> Some of it, she didn't seem to have a favorite, must have been 15+
>>> years old.
>>> ... does it die in the can? ...
>> I bought stuff that is supposedly rebranded hairspray for 3D printing.
>>
>> The first bottle I bought seems to have lost effectiveness. I'm on the
>> second can even though the first can seems to be ejecting something,
>> and is not yet empty. So my answer: Could be!
>>
>> Roger.
> The local evidence seems to agree. No mixing balls can be heard in 2 cans, and
> no shake well instructions are on the cans. With a mixing ball, I'd expect
> shake well instructions. Might say aussie in big print, says P&G in the fine
> print.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett.
NH
nop head
Thu, Dec 16, 2021 11:00 PM
There is a big difference between TPU and PP. TPU's are rubbery whereas PP
is slippery and flexible. It doesn't compress when squeezed or stretch when
pulled, like TPU does.
On Thu, 16 Dec 2021 at 22:54, Raymond West raywest@raywest.com wrote:
Just get the cheapest hairspray you can, and the strongest - you may have
the equivalent of 'the pound shop' . Some folk use a glue stick
(pritt/whatever) I could never get it on smooth enough. A useful chart wrt
properties
https://www.simplify3d.com/support/materials-guide/properties-table/
You realise you can get different stiffness grades of tpu. I bought some
cheap Ziro tpu filament, says it's Shore A 95. E-sun have a tpe with
Shore 83A, but often no information is given (and even if it is, no
guarantee of accuracy, I expect.
On 16/12/2021 19:49, gene heskett wrote:
On Thursday, December 16, 2021 12:11:49 PM EST Rogier Wolff wrote:
On 12/16/2021 10:27 AM, gene heskett wrote:
Some of it, she didn't seem to have a favorite, must have been 15+
years old.
... does it die in the can? ...
I bought stuff that is supposedly rebranded hairspray for 3D printing.
The first bottle I bought seems to have lost effectiveness. I'm on the
second can even though the first can seems to be ejecting something,
and is not yet empty. So my answer: Could be!
Roger.
The local evidence seems to agree. No mixing balls can be heard in 2 cans, and
no shake well instructions are on the cans. With a mixing ball, I'd expect
shake well instructions. Might say aussie in big print, says P&G in the fine
print.
Cheers, Gene Heskett.
OpenSCAD mailing list
To unsubscribe send an email to discuss-leave@lists.openscad.org
There is a big difference between TPU and PP. TPU's are rubbery whereas PP
is slippery and flexible. It doesn't compress when squeezed or stretch when
pulled, like TPU does.
On Thu, 16 Dec 2021 at 22:54, Raymond West <raywest@raywest.com> wrote:
> Just get the cheapest hairspray you can, and the strongest - you may have
> the equivalent of 'the pound shop' . Some folk use a glue stick
> (pritt/whatever) I could never get it on smooth enough. A useful chart wrt
> properties
> https://www.simplify3d.com/support/materials-guide/properties-table/
>
> You realise you can get different stiffness grades of tpu. I bought some
> cheap Ziro tpu filament, says it's Shore A 95. E-sun have a tpe with
> Shore 83A, but often no information is given (and even if it is, no
> guarantee of accuracy, I expect.
> On 16/12/2021 19:49, gene heskett wrote:
>
> On Thursday, December 16, 2021 12:11:49 PM EST Rogier Wolff wrote:
>
> On 12/16/2021 10:27 AM, gene heskett wrote:
>
> Some of it, she didn't seem to have a favorite, must have been 15+
> years old.
> ... does it die in the can? ...
>
> I bought stuff that is supposedly rebranded hairspray for 3D printing.
>
> The first bottle I bought seems to have lost effectiveness. I'm on the
> second can even though the first can seems to be ejecting something,
> and is not yet empty. So my answer: Could be!
>
> Roger.
>
> The local evidence seems to agree. No mixing balls can be heard in 2 cans, and
> no shake well instructions are on the cans. With a mixing ball, I'd expect
> shake well instructions. Might say aussie in big print, says P&G in the fine
> print.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett.
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenSCAD mailing list
> To unsubscribe send an email to discuss-leave@lists.openscad.org
>
GH
gene heskett
Fri, Dec 17, 2021 1:14 AM
On Thursday, December 16, 2021 5:54:21 PM EST Raymond West wrote:
You guys are keeping my printer wam tonight, thanks
Cheers, Gene Heskett.
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
On Thursday, December 16, 2021 5:54:21 PM EST Raymond West wrote:
> Just get the cheapest hairspray you can, and the strongest - you may
> have the equivalent of 'the pound shop' . Some folk use a glue stick
> (pritt/whatever) I could never get it on smooth enough. A useful chart
> wrt properties
> https://www.simplify3d.com/support/materials-guide/properties-table/
>
You guys are keeping my printer wam tonight, thanks
Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
- Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>