Hi guys, My troubles seem to be at no end at the moment! After reinstalling my Windows 8.1 due to a hard drive change, i've been having trouble with my B200 on HDSDR using Balints ExtIO_USRP+FCD+RTL2832U + BorIP-1.6 BETA 3. Before re-installing Windows 8.1, i had no issues at all, but since re-installing, i've been getting what seem like ghost signals on airband. They appear from about 114MHz through to 128MHz. They appear to be broadcast FM, Trunking and MotoTRBO signals, though when i move the frequency slider, they vanish, only to reappear when i move further along the band. I've included a picture of the problem, and my settings in ExtIO: https://www.dropbox.com/s/o6u3oe83ch4gm9o/Signals.jpg?dl=0 and my settings: https://www.dropbox.com/s/082d17pi0osnw36/Settings.jpg?dl=0 I'm running the B200 over USB 3, and it's using 003.007.001, which unfortunately, i can't seem to upgrade due to getting an incompatability warning when trying to use HDSDR after upgrading. I've installed the B200 USB Driver, and in Device Manager, my device shows up as USRP B200. Does anyone have any idea what could be causing this problem, and any possible solution? Thanks for any help, Paul

Hi Paul, sorry to hear you're still in trouble; I'll try my best to help you, though HDSDR and Windows are really not my forte. Balint is currently not in office, so I can only give you my piece of insight: first of all, I'm a bit confused; your settings say you've got a sampling rate of 16MS/s, and your center frequency is 120.8MHz, so your observable spectrum should be 112.8MHz - 128.8MHz. However, HDSDR's waterfall shows different frequency limits -- maybe there's some sweeping or caching, or is maybe my definition of tuning and LO frequency different from that of HDSDR? I can, however, explain the incompatibility warning: HDSDR is linked against a specific version of UHD, and can only work with exactly that version of the UHD.dll, which is why Balint packages it with the whole Extio framework. Installing a more modern version of UHD system-wide doesn't help you, here, since HDSDR continues to use the packaged UHD.dll. Thus, after installation of UHD and flashing of the images, you've got "modern" FPGA and firmware on your B200, and "old" UHD talking to the device -- which is what the error complains about. Regarding your ghost signals: Those are interesting, though, if I read that correctly, they are at -82dB, which is relatively little, considering your 27dB gain. Can you try to disable AGC? If that's not enough, my first guess would be to play around with gain: Too much gain leads to spectral images[1], too little gain together with AGC might over-emphasize spurs. Greetings, Marcus [1] If you have a strong signal, and high gain, your amplifier, being composed of nothing more than transistors, goes into saturation; the transmission function then is no longer practically output = input * gain ($y(t) = a x(t)$), but gets a quadratic term ($y(t) = ax(t) - bx^2(t)$); now using the some properties of the trigonometric functions, in this case $\sin \alpha \; \sin \beta = \frac{1}{2}\left(\cos (\alpha-\beta) - \cos (\alpha+\beta)\right)$ applied to an input signal $x(t) = \sin(f t)$, you'll notice that for $x^2 = \sin^2(ft)= \sin(ft)\sin(ft) = \frac12 \left(\cos(ft-ft)-\cos(ft+ft)\right)$ you see a signal with twice the input frequency. In fact, semiconductor mixers are usually based on that principle, and thus are basically amplifiers driven out of spec :) On 04/23/2015 01:07 AM, Paul B via USRP-users wrote: > Hi guys, > > My troubles seem to be at no end at the moment! > > After reinstalling my Windows 8.1 due to a hard drive change, i've > been having trouble with my B200 on HDSDR using > Balints ExtIO_USRP+FCD+RTL2832U + BorIP-1.6 BETA 3. > > Before re-installing Windows 8.1, i had no issues at all, but since > re-installing, i've been getting what seem like ghost signals on > airband. They appear from about 114MHz through to 128MHz. They appear > to be broadcast FM, Trunking and MotoTRBO signals, though when i move > the frequency slider, they vanish, only to reappear when i move > further along the band. > > I've included a picture of the problem, and my settings in ExtIO: > > https://www.dropbox.com/s/o6u3oe83ch4gm9o/Signals.jpg?dl=0 > > and my settings: > > https://www.dropbox.com/s/082d17pi0osnw36/Settings.jpg?dl=0 > > I'm running the B200 over USB 3, and it's using 003.007.001, which > unfortunately, i can't seem to upgrade due to getting an > incompatability warning when trying to use HDSDR after upgrading. > I've installed the B200 USB Driver, and in Device Manager, my device > shows up as USRP B200. > > Does anyone have any idea what could be causing this problem, and any > possible solution? > > Thanks for any help, > > Paul > > > > _______________________________________________ > USRP-users mailing list > USRP-users@lists.ettus.com > http://lists.ettus.com/mailman/listinfo/usrp-users_lists.ettus.com

Hi Marcus, Thank you for your advice and the explanation of the HDSDR/UHD incompatability. Regarding the tuning, i believe that my centre frequency is 122.590MHz, and i can tune to +/- 8MHz either side of that. I’m not completely sure though, as i’m still rather new to the whole SDR scene, and the B200 is my first major SDR since using the RTL Dongles. I’ve managed to, i think, narrow down the problem to the computer i’m using. I tried the B200 on my partners laptop, plugging it in, installing Balints ExtIO package, zadig driver and libusb0 and it seemed to work fine. No ghost signals at all. Admittedly it was using USB 2, but even when using USB 2 on my main computer, i was still getting ghost signals. The computer i use the B200 with is running the USB 3.0 Intel eXtensible host controller, which i believe is compatible with the B200 series, and i’ve done a complete fresh install of Windows 8.1, installing Balints package, and using the zadig driver only, so i can’t see the error being within Windows. I’ve also noticed they appear even with rather low gain, but only within 110MHz – 135MHz region. I’ve not seen any signals above that, that shouldn’t be there. Paul From: Marcus Müllervia USRP-users Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2015 7:27 PM To: usrp-users@lists.ettus.com Subject: Re: [USRP-users] B200 Broadcast FM and other signals on airband Hi Paul, sorry to hear you're still in trouble; I'll try my best to help you, though HDSDR and Windows are really not my forte. Balint is currently not in office, so I can only give you my piece of insight: first of all, I'm a bit confused; your settings say you've got a sampling rate of 16MS/s, and your center frequency is 120.8MHz, so your observable spectrum should be 112.8MHz - 128.8MHz. However, HDSDR's waterfall shows different frequency limits -- maybe there's some sweeping or caching, or is maybe my definition of tuning and LO frequency different from that of HDSDR? I can, however, explain the incompatibility warning: HDSDR is linked against a specific version of UHD, and can only work with exactly that version of the UHD.dll, which is why Balint packages it with the whole Extio framework. Installing a more modern version of UHD system-wide doesn't help you, here, since HDSDR continues to use the packaged UHD.dll. Thus, after installation of UHD and flashing of the images, you've got "modern" FPGA and firmware on your B200, and "old" UHD talking to the device -- which is what the error complains about. Regarding your ghost signals: Those are interesting, though, if I read that correctly, they are at -82dB, which is relatively little, considering your 27dB gain. Can you try to disable AGC? If that's not enough, my first guess would be to play around with gain: Too much gain leads to spectral images[1], too little gain together with AGC might over-emphasize spurs. Greetings, Marcus [1] If you have a strong signal, and high gain, your amplifier, being composed of nothing more than transistors, goes into saturation; the transmission function then is no longer practically output = input * gain (), but gets a quadratic term (); now using the some properties of the trigonometric functions, in this case applied to an input signal , you'll notice that for you see a signal with twice the input frequency. In fact, semiconductor mixers are usually based on that principle, and thus are basically amplifiers driven out of spec :) On 04/23/2015 01:07 AM, Paul B via USRP-users wrote: Hi guys, My troubles seem to be at no end at the moment! After reinstalling my Windows 8.1 due to a hard drive change, i've been having trouble with my B200 on HDSDR using Balints ExtIO_USRP+FCD+RTL2832U + BorIP-1.6 BETA 3. Before re-installing Windows 8.1, i had no issues at all, but since re-installing, i've been getting what seem like ghost signals on airband. They appear from about 114MHz through to 128MHz. They appear to be broadcast FM, Trunking and MotoTRBO signals, though when i move the frequency slider, they vanish, only to reappear when i move further along the band. I've included a picture of the problem, and my settings in ExtIO: https://www.dropbox.com/s/o6u3oe83ch4gm9o/Signals.jpg?dl=0 and my settings: https://www.dropbox.com/s/082d17pi0osnw36/Settings.jpg?dl=0 I'm running the B200 over USB 3, and it's using 003.007.001, which unfortunately, i can't seem to upgrade due to getting an incompatability warning when trying to use HDSDR after upgrading. I've installed the B200 USB Driver, and in Device Manager, my device shows up as USRP B200. Does anyone have any idea what could be causing this problem, and any possible solution? Thanks for any help, Paul _______________________________________________ USRP-users mailing list USRP-users@lists.ettus.com http://lists.ettus.com/mailman/listinfo/usrp-users_lists.ettus.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ USRP-users mailing list USRP-users@lists.ettus.com http://lists.ettus.com/mailman/listinfo/usrp-users_lists.ettus.com

On 04/23/2015 04:43 PM, Paul B via USRP-users wrote: > Hi Marcus, > Thank you for your advice and the explanation of the HDSDR/UHD > incompatability. > Regarding the tuning, i believe that my centre frequency is > 122.590MHz, and i can tune to +/- 8MHz either side of that. I'm not > completely sure though, as i'm still rather new to the whole SDR > scene, and the B200 is my first major SDR since using the RTL Dongles. > I've managed to, i think, narrow down the problem to the computer i'm > using. I tried the B200 on my partners laptop, plugging it in, > installing Balints ExtIO package, zadig driver and libusb0 and it > seemed to work fine. No ghost signals at all. Admittedly it was using > USB 2, but even when using USB 2 on my main computer, i was still > getting ghost signals. > The computer i use the B200 with is running the USB 3.0 Intel > eXtensible host controller, which i believe is compatible with the > B200 series, and i've done a complete fresh install of Windows 8.1, > installing Balints package, and using the zadig driver only, so i > can't see the error being within Windows. > I've also noticed they appear even with rather low gain, but only > within 110MHz -- 135MHz region. I've not seen any signals above that, > that shouldn't be there. > Paul You may, then, not be dealing with intermodulation or other non-linearity products at all then, but rather, spurs produced by your computer, and carried along the USB cable, or just plain radiated by your computer. > *From:* Marcus Müllervia USRP-users <mailto:usrp-users@lists.ettus.com> > *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2015 7:27 PM > *To:* usrp-users@lists.ettus.com <mailto:usrp-users@lists.ettus.com> > *Subject:* Re: [USRP-users] B200 Broadcast FM and other signals on airband > Hi Paul, > > sorry to hear you're still in trouble; I'll try my best to help you, > though HDSDR and Windows are really not my forte. > Balint is currently not in office, so I can only give you my piece of > insight: > > first of all, I'm a bit confused; your settings say you've got a > sampling rate of 16MS/s, and your center frequency is 120.8MHz, so > your observable spectrum should be 112.8MHz - 128.8MHz. However, > HDSDR's waterfall shows different frequency limits -- maybe there's > some sweeping or caching, or is maybe my definition of tuning and LO > frequency different from that of HDSDR? > > I can, however, explain the incompatibility warning: HDSDR is linked > against a specific version of UHD, and can only work with exactly that > version of the UHD.dll, which is why Balint packages it with the whole > Extio framework. Installing a more modern version of UHD system-wide > doesn't help you, here, since HDSDR continues to use the packaged > UHD.dll. Thus, after installation of UHD and flashing of the images, > you've got "modern" FPGA and firmware on your B200, and "old" UHD > talking to the device -- which is what the error complains about. > > Regarding your ghost signals: Those are interesting, though, if I read > that correctly, they are at -82dB, which is relatively little, > considering your 27dB gain. Can you try to disable AGC? If that's not > enough, my first guess would be to play around with gain: Too much > gain leads to spectral images[1], too little gain together with AGC > might over-emphasize spurs. > > Greetings, > Marcus > > [1] If you have a strong signal, and high gain, your amplifier, being > composed of nothing more than transistors, goes into saturation; the > transmission function then is no longer practically output = input * > gain ($y(t) = a x(t)$), but gets a quadratic term ($y(t) = ax(t) - > bx^2(t)$); now using the some properties of the trigonometric > functions, in this case $\sin \alpha \; \sin \beta = > \frac{1}{2}\left(\cos (\alpha-\beta) - \cos (\alpha+\beta)\right)$ > applied to an input signal $x(t) = \sin(f t)$, you'll notice that for > $x^2 = \sin^2(ft)= \sin(ft)\sin(ft) = \frac12 > \left(\cos(ft-ft)-\cos(ft+ft)\right)$ you see a signal with twice the > input frequency. In fact, semiconductor mixers are usually based on > that principle, and thus are basically amplifiers driven out of spec :) > > > On 04/23/2015 01:07 AM, Paul B via USRP-users wrote: >> Hi guys, >> My troubles seem to be at no end at the moment! >> After reinstalling my Windows 8.1 due to a hard drive change, i've >> been having trouble with my B200 on HDSDR using Balints >> ExtIO_USRP+FCD+RTL2832U + BorIP-1.6 BETA 3. >> Before re-installing Windows 8.1, i had no issues at all, but since >> re-installing, i've been getting what seem like ghost signals on >> airband. They appear from about 114MHz through to 128MHz. They appear >> to be broadcast FM, Trunking and MotoTRBO signals, though when i move >> the frequency slider, they vanish, only to reappear when i move >> further along the band. >> I've included a picture of the problem, and my settings in ExtIO: >> https://www.dropbox.com/s/o6u3oe83ch4gm9o/Signals.jpg?dl=0 >> and my settings: >> https://www.dropbox.com/s/082d17pi0osnw36/Settings.jpg?dl=0 >> I'm running the B200 over USB 3, and it's using 003.007.001, which >> unfortunately, i can't seem to upgrade due to getting an >> incompatability warning when trying to use HDSDR after upgrading. >> I've installed the B200 USB Driver, and in Device Manager, my device >> shows up as USRP B200. >> Does anyone have any idea what could be causing this problem, and any >> possible solution? >> Thanks for any help, >> Paul >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> USRP-users mailing list >> USRP-users@lists.ettus.com >> http://lists.ettus.com/mailman/listinfo/usrp-users_lists.ettus.com > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > _______________________________________________ > USRP-users mailing list > USRP-users@lists.ettus.com > http://lists.ettus.com/mailman/listinfo/usrp-users_lists.ettus.com > > > _______________________________________________ > USRP-users mailing list > USRP-users@lists.ettus.com > http://lists.ettus.com/mailman/listinfo/usrp-users_lists.ettus.com