Distributed Power Systems
I have recently read of a new approach to power distribution on boats. This
new 3-wire power distribution system uses significantly less copper wire
and can be used on boats as small as 18 ft. or, for example, up to maybe the
QE2.
My question is: does anyone have any current experience with or has read
reports on the cost affectivity of this approach for either new builds or
retro-fits? From the descriptions I have read, it seems to be relatively
simple to install and maintain, although I suspect a near or direct
lightning strike could be devastating, unless there are some pretty heavy
duty surge protectors installed. Maybe even this would not be enough. I
could not find any information on cost effectiveness. Maybe the technology
is too new.
Any information would be appreciated.
Thanks,
John
John:
Have you read Nigel Calder's 2005 article in Professional Boatbuilder? I
think it is kind of the standard work on 3-wire. It mentions a builder that
is incorporating the technology (or perhaps "philosophy") into their boats,
and notes a 40% reduction in cable run distance.
I tried to get a major trawler builder to do 3-wire in a new boat and they
refused. I think the idea makes complete sense, though; electricity
distribution is an (another?) area in which the marine industry is quite
hidebound. All modern cars and airplanes use a 3-wire scheme.
/afb
Adam, don't feel bad about that one builder. I have been trying to promote
a three wire system for the past 10 years and not one boat builder is
willing to try it. Searay was experimenting with a limited scope test
system but apparently dropped it.
Meanwhile the RV and custom coach market is jumping on board. The marine
industry is not only hide bound, its a dinosaur when it comes to innovating
new technology that has been standard in the land vehicle industry for over
a decade.
Arild
----- Original Message -----
From: "Adam Block" adam.block@gmail.com
To: passagemaking-under-power@lists.samurai.com
Sent: Tuesday, June 09, 2009 5:36 PM
Subject: Re: [PUP] Distributed Power Systems
John:
Have you read Nigel Calder's 2005 article in Professional Boatbuilder? I
think it is kind of the standard work on 3-wire. It mentions a builder
that
is incorporating the technology (or perhaps "philosophy") into their
boats,
and notes a 40% reduction in cable run distance.
I tried to get a major trawler builder to do 3-wire in a new boat and they
refused. I think the idea makes complete sense, though; electricity
distribution is an (another?) area in which the marine industry is quite
hidebound. All modern cars and airplanes use a 3-wire scheme.
/afb
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For a different approach to same problem, see this:
http://www.panbo.com/archives/2007/08/distributed_power_no_bus_no_code.html
or (shorter)
This involves a power bus with relay/circuit breakers at each load
point. It is wildly complicated to wire and clearly expensive, but
it is very fault-tolerant.
Best,
Steve
----- Original Message -----
Steven Dubnoff wrote
For a different approach to same problem, see this:
http://www.panbo.com/archives/2007/08/distributed_power_no_bus_no_code.html
This involves a power bus with relay/circuit breakers at each load point.
It is wildly complicated to wire and clearly expensive, but it is very
fault-tolerant.
REPLY
It is unfortunate that nearly all these approaches look intimidating to the
non techical persons. Its also true that in most cases the person making
the crucial yes/no decisions in most companies are often not technical. And
many buyers are even less technical. Their first reaction to seeing
something complex is "how would I ever cope with a problem in this system"
Would I have to pay for flying in a specialist from the factory to fix it?
"
Problem solving by replacing a light bulb or resetting a circuit breaker is
something they understand and feel comfortable with doing. Once the
technology goes beyond that stage, owners become increasingly uncomfortable
about dealing with any trouble shooting.
The automotive world recognized this and kept quiet about how they
implemented digital controlled power busses in their new vehicles. Just
look at how many vehicles now have digital distributed control power
busses. Given the number of service centers, dealership etc. it was not a
big hardship for an owner to go to nearest dealer asking to have something
fixed.
Boat owners by contrast like to get off the beaten path and frequent quiet
coves, distant shores and generally get away from the maddening crowd.
Now the situation alters drastically. They know they have to be more self
reliant. Replacing bulbs, fuses or reseting breakers they can deal with.
Trouble shooting a complicated myriad of wires intimidates them. So
naturally they will not opt for such a system if it scares them.
How about a system where the only trouble shooting consist of resetting a
breaker or plugging in a replacement relay? And you never have to worry
about reprogramming a computer as is the case with every one of the systems
Nigel Calder and others are presently advocating. That is probably more
comforting to a non technical boat buyer. They can feel comfortable with
it. Even Calder who admittedly has lots of knowledge and experience says
he is installing a parallel non digital system - Just in case.
cheers
Arild
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steven Dubnoff"
,> see this on Panbo:
REPLY
Perusing the Panbo article I took note of Ben's comment about the sight
lines to the instruments. Using the seat back as a guide it looks to me
like the instruments are tilted too flat ( closer to horizontal)
Whenever I have to design a helm station I establish the height of eye of
the owner standing at the helm. If a STIDD seat is available ( looks liek
a STIDD in photo) the height of eye usually doesn't drop by much but other
seats can make a foot of difference.
Having the height of eye established I draw a line to center of display
then draw a perpendicular to this sight line. That establishes the angle
of the console for optimum viewing. To many LCD displays do not have
adequate off center viewing angle.
If the height of eye drops excessively when the helmsperson is seated, I
estabish a second sight line. Then it becomes a question of picking an
average or making some other accomodation to give good viewing from both
positions.
I has been my observation that many boat helms have used styling criteria
rather than ergonomics to determine console face angle.
regards
Arild
----- Original Message ----
From: "2elnav@netbistro.com"
To: Steven Dubnoff sdubnoff@circlesys.com
Cc:
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009
8:35:34 PM
Subject: [PUP] Sight lines to instruments
Having the height
of eye established I draw a line to center of display then
draw a
perpendicular to this sight line.
Arild, I have instruments in a dash
console as well as instruments in an overhead console on my boat. I think my
overhead console is tilted a bit too much. The Admiral on my boat, who is 6
inches shorter than I, thinks the angle is just perfect. I think the right
choice was made!
Patrick
Willard 40PH
ALOHA
La Paz, MX