PTTI 2012
Paul,
Regarding SSR-Pricing, Synergy said they will make the new SSR-6Tr timing board
available at $35 FOB San Diego (about half the $69.85 commercial price) for
educational pursuits which include Ham radio, educational institutions,
experimenters, etc. (limit one part per customer). For comparison, the u-Blox
LEA-6T module alone sells for more than $100 each in low quantities.
The best way to ask Synergy about this is by using the form at
http://www.synergy-gps.com/index.php?option=com_artforms&formid=1&Itemid=198.
Rick
W2GPS
-----Original Message-----
From: paul swed [mailto:paulswedb@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, December 06, 2012 12:02 PM
To: Tom Van Baak; Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PTTI 2012, part 3/3
Great comments and a good read. OK so what does the drop in replacement cost???
Thanks lots to read here.
Later
Paul
WB8TSL
On Thu, Dec 6, 2012 at 10:24 AM, Tom Van Baak tvb@leapsecond.com wrote:
Still, there are always a number of talks of more general interest to us
time nuts.
In the next few postings I'll give more details on a couple of topics:
And here's the third part of my PTTI report...
- Vendor presentations/Symmetricom/Miles
Besides 3 days of presentations, PTTI also hosts a vendor/exhibit area.
This includes the usual T&F suspects like FEI, Symmetricom, TRAK,
Spectracom, SpectraDynamics, TimeTech, etc. Most of this gear is outside
the budget of a regular time-nut but it's always nice to see and touch
what's on display, knowing in ten years it will show up on eBay.
Yes, that was John Miles in the Symmetricom booth showing off his, I mean,
their new TimePod and wearing a Symmetricom shirt. We've had a number of
time nut "graduates" over the years: Rick Hambly went on to start CNS
Systems, Said Jackson started Jackson Labs, John Miles became Miles LLC and
both have ties with Symmetricom. You'll see press releases like this one:
<
If you have more questions, I'm sure John will be happy to answer then on-
or off- the list.
- M12/uBlox GPS board
It was very nice to see Tom Clark ("grandfather" of time-nuts) at PTTI; it
was from his work at NASA with VLBI, masers, and Motorola Oncore GPS
receivers that a number of us caught the precise time bug in the early 90's.
Many of you know him as the author of the often recommended paper
"Critical Evaluation of the Motorola M12+ GPS Timing Receiver vs. the
Master Clock at the United States Naval Observatory, Washington DC" which
is available here:
http://www.gpstime.com/files/PTTI/PTTI_2002_CNS_Testbed.pdf
http://www.gpstime.com/files/PTTI/PTTI_2002_CNS_Testbed_VG.ppt
Anyway, this year Tom Clark presented performance results of a new GPS
board. It is h/w and s/w compatible with the Motorola M12 receiver used in
many existing T&F products, but it's based on a uBlox-6T chip instead of
the Motorola or iLotus M12 chip. The trick is that Rick Hambly added a PIC
on the board to make it talk exactly like an M12. The reason for this is to
allow drop-in replacement of the original Motorola M12 or still-current
iLotus M12+ with this new one. It's called the Synergy SSR-6T.
That means that any instrument (e.g., GPSDO) that uses an M12 can be
upgraded to the uBlox-6T. Tom's presentation contains charts showing the
performance improvement:
<
http://www.cnssys.com/publications.php
I have one to play with and hope to duplicate his results. I didn't get
pricing/availability info but it is supposed to be "really cheap". (Tom
Clark -- can you provide this info when you get it?)
- Quartz in space
With all the focus on fiber and optical and atomic clocks, it's refreshing
to hear now and then about good old quartz. This was a fascinating talk
about real-world (or real out-of-this-world) performance of quartz
oscillators in space. What they did was mine recorded telemetry from many
space missions looking to directly/indirectly measure the frequency of the
quartz oscillator over years in space.
Just like we use LH to monitor the EFC of a GPSDO, they monitor the EFC of
the quartz LO in the GPS sats. In addition to normal drift there are
effects of radiation dose and solar flares. I'll post the URL of the paper
when it's out. Meanwhile I saw a bunch of fine papers/presentations at the
FEI site:
http://www.freqelec.com/tech_lit.html
- ION/PTTI 2013 in Bellevue, WA (!)
After 44 years, PTTI is changing "management". Instead of being organized
by the US government (USNO, NASA, JPL, and DoD) it will now be run by ION
(Institute of Navigation). This keeps the government out of the hospitality
and conference business.
The next ION/PTTI will be held in Bellevue, WA. If you haven't considered
attending an ION or PTTI conference before, this might be a good one to
try. Also, since that's my hometown, I plan to have an "open house" during
the conference. That means I have a year to clean up the lab so more than
one person can walk in it...
A number of people continued to comment on the relativity experiment I did
a few years ago. I have now posted the original (190 page) power-point
presentation I gave at PTTI that year:
http://www.leapsecond.com/ptti2006/
- The state of Time-Nuts
Lastly, I wanted to make a note about time-nuts. I was pleasantly
surprised how many professionals already know about the time-nuts list or
lurk here. This group has really done well. Perhaps propelled by advances
in the telecom/optical world or neutrino experiments, there's a whole new
crop of scientists in the precise time field. Formal technical journal
articles by PhD's tend not to deal with the mundane details of precise time
measurement and lab equipment so people turn to google, and find us here.
As the list grows we face some issues about posting bandwidth, focus, and
repetition. The list is mostly unmoderated, so it's completely up to you to
keep the list relevant and interesting. Please resist too off-topic posts
or low-content postings. For now at least, the archived list is rich enough
that it acts like a wiki or faq.
As usual, if you have suggestions on how to make the list better please
send them to me (tvb@LeapSecond.com) and John (jra@febo.com).
Thanks,
/tvb
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
Thanks I will try this out. Pretty darn interesting indeed and at $35.
Great. Thats my kind O price.
Regards
Paul
WB8TSL
On Fri, Dec 7, 2012 at 8:39 AM, W2GPS w2gps@cnssys.com wrote:
Paul,
Regarding SSR-Pricing, Synergy said they will make the new SSR-6Tr timing
board
available at $35 FOB San Diego (about half the $69.85 commercial price) for
educational pursuits which include Ham radio, educational institutions,
experimenters, etc. (limit one part per customer). For comparison, the
u-Blox
LEA-6T module alone sells for more than $100 each in low quantities.
The best way to ask Synergy about this is by using the form at
http://www.synergy-gps.com/index.php?option=com_artforms&formid=1&Itemid=198
.
Rick
W2GPS
-----Original Message-----
From: paul swed [mailto:paulswedb@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, December 06, 2012 12:02 PM
To: Tom Van Baak; Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PTTI 2012, part 3/3
Great comments and a good read. OK so what does the drop in replacement
cost???
Thanks lots to read here.
Later
Paul
WB8TSL
On Thu, Dec 6, 2012 at 10:24 AM, Tom Van Baak tvb@leapsecond.com wrote:
Still, there are always a number of talks of more general interest to
us
time nuts.
In the next few postings I'll give more details on a couple of topics:
And here's the third part of my PTTI report...
- Vendor presentations/Symmetricom/Miles
Besides 3 days of presentations, PTTI also hosts a vendor/exhibit area.
This includes the usual T&F suspects like FEI, Symmetricom, TRAK,
Spectracom, SpectraDynamics, TimeTech, etc. Most of this gear is outside
the budget of a regular time-nut but it's always nice to see and touch
what's on display, knowing in ten years it will show up on eBay.
Yes, that was John Miles in the Symmetricom booth showing off his, I
mean,
their new TimePod and wearing a Symmetricom shirt. We've had a number of
time nut "graduates" over the years: Rick Hambly went on to start CNS
Systems, Said Jackson started Jackson Labs, John Miles became Miles LLC
and
both have ties with Symmetricom. You'll see press releases like this one:
<
If you have more questions, I'm sure John will be happy to answer then
on-
or off- the list.
- M12/uBlox GPS board
It was very nice to see Tom Clark ("grandfather" of time-nuts) at PTTI;
it
was from his work at NASA with VLBI, masers, and Motorola Oncore GPS
receivers that a number of us caught the precise time bug in the early
90's.
Many of you know him as the author of the often recommended paper
"Critical Evaluation of the Motorola M12+ GPS Timing Receiver vs. the
Master Clock at the United States Naval Observatory, Washington DC" which
is available here:
http://www.gpstime.com/files/PTTI/PTTI_2002_CNS_Testbed.pdf
http://www.gpstime.com/files/PTTI/PTTI_2002_CNS_Testbed_VG.ppt
Anyway, this year Tom Clark presented performance results of a new GPS
board. It is h/w and s/w compatible with the Motorola M12 receiver used
in
many existing T&F products, but it's based on a uBlox-6T chip instead of
the Motorola or iLotus M12 chip. The trick is that Rick Hambly added a
PIC
on the board to make it talk exactly like an M12. The reason for this is
to
allow drop-in replacement of the original Motorola M12 or still-current
iLotus M12+ with this new one. It's called the Synergy SSR-6T.
That means that any instrument (e.g., GPSDO) that uses an M12 can be
upgraded to the uBlox-6T. Tom's presentation contains charts showing the
performance improvement:
<
http://www.cnssys.com/publications.php
I have one to play with and hope to duplicate his results. I didn't get
pricing/availability info but it is supposed to be "really cheap". (Tom
Clark -- can you provide this info when you get it?)
- Quartz in space
With all the focus on fiber and optical and atomic clocks, it's
refreshing
to hear now and then about good old quartz. This was a fascinating talk
about real-world (or real out-of-this-world) performance of quartz
oscillators in space. What they did was mine recorded telemetry from many
space missions looking to directly/indirectly measure the frequency of
the
quartz oscillator over years in space.
Just like we use LH to monitor the EFC of a GPSDO, they monitor the EFC
of
the quartz LO in the GPS sats. In addition to normal drift there are
effects of radiation dose and solar flares. I'll post the URL of the
paper
when it's out. Meanwhile I saw a bunch of fine papers/presentations at
the
FEI site:
http://www.freqelec.com/tech_lit.html
- ION/PTTI 2013 in Bellevue, WA (!)
After 44 years, PTTI is changing "management". Instead of being organized
by the US government (USNO, NASA, JPL, and DoD) it will now be run by ION
(Institute of Navigation). This keeps the government out of the
hospitality
and conference business.
The next ION/PTTI will be held in Bellevue, WA. If you haven't considered
attending an ION or PTTI conference before, this might be a good one to
try. Also, since that's my hometown, I plan to have an "open house"
during
the conference. That means I have a year to clean up the lab so more than
one person can walk in it...
A number of people continued to comment on the relativity experiment I
did
a few years ago. I have now posted the original (190 page) power-point
presentation I gave at PTTI that year:
http://www.leapsecond.com/ptti2006/
- The state of Time-Nuts
Lastly, I wanted to make a note about time-nuts. I was pleasantly
surprised how many professionals already know about the time-nuts list or
lurk here. This group has really done well. Perhaps propelled by advances
in the telecom/optical world or neutrino experiments, there's a whole new
crop of scientists in the precise time field. Formal technical journal
articles by PhD's tend not to deal with the mundane details of precise
time
measurement and lab equipment so people turn to google, and find us here.
As the list grows we face some issues about posting bandwidth, focus, and
repetition. The list is mostly unmoderated, so it's completely up to you
to
keep the list relevant and interesting. Please resist too off-topic posts
or low-content postings. For now at least, the archived list is rich
enough
that it acts like a wiki or faq.
As usual, if you have suggestions on how to make the list better please
send them to me (tvb@LeapSecond.com) and John (jra@febo.com).
Thanks,
/tvb
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
They did respond back and I am limited to 1. Wanted 2 but such is life. :-)
Will order most likely Monday.
Regards
Paul
WB8TSL
On Fri, Dec 7, 2012 at 11:45 AM, paul swed paulswedb@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks I will try this out. Pretty darn interesting indeed and at $35.
Great. Thats my kind O price.
Regards
Paul
WB8TSL
On Fri, Dec 7, 2012 at 8:39 AM, W2GPS w2gps@cnssys.com wrote:
Paul,
Regarding SSR-Pricing, Synergy said they will make the new SSR-6Tr timing
board
available at $35 FOB San Diego (about half the $69.85 commercial price)
for
educational pursuits which include Ham radio, educational institutions,
experimenters, etc. (limit one part per customer). For comparison, the
u-Blox
LEA-6T module alone sells for more than $100 each in low quantities.
The best way to ask Synergy about this is by using the form at
http://www.synergy-gps.com/index.php?option=com_artforms&formid=1&Itemid=198
.
Rick
W2GPS
-----Original Message-----
From: paul swed [mailto:paulswedb@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, December 06, 2012 12:02 PM
To: Tom Van Baak; Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PTTI 2012, part 3/3
Great comments and a good read. OK so what does the drop in replacement
cost???
Thanks lots to read here.
Later
Paul
WB8TSL
On Thu, Dec 6, 2012 at 10:24 AM, Tom Van Baak tvb@leapsecond.com wrote:
Still, there are always a number of talks of more general interest to
us
time nuts.
In the next few postings I'll give more details on a couple of topics:
And here's the third part of my PTTI report...
- Vendor presentations/Symmetricom/Miles
Besides 3 days of presentations, PTTI also hosts a vendor/exhibit area.
This includes the usual T&F suspects like FEI, Symmetricom, TRAK,
Spectracom, SpectraDynamics, TimeTech, etc. Most of this gear is outside
the budget of a regular time-nut but it's always nice to see and touch
what's on display, knowing in ten years it will show up on eBay.
Yes, that was John Miles in the Symmetricom booth showing off his, I
mean,
their new TimePod and wearing a Symmetricom shirt. We've had a number of
time nut "graduates" over the years: Rick Hambly went on to start CNS
Systems, Said Jackson started Jackson Labs, John Miles became Miles LLC
and
both have ties with Symmetricom. You'll see press releases like this
one:
<
http://www.gpsworld.com/symmetricom-expands-test-set-portfolio-with-high-perform
ance-test-probehttp://www.gpsworld.com/symmetricom-expands-test-set-portfolio-with-high-performance-test-probe
If you have more questions, I'm sure John will be happy to answer then
on-
or off- the list.
- M12/uBlox GPS board
It was very nice to see Tom Clark ("grandfather" of time-nuts) at PTTI;
it
was from his work at NASA with VLBI, masers, and Motorola Oncore GPS
receivers that a number of us caught the precise time bug in the early
90's.
Many of you know him as the author of the often recommended paper
"Critical Evaluation of the Motorola M12+ GPS Timing Receiver vs. the
Master Clock at the United States Naval Observatory, Washington DC"
which
is available here:
http://www.gpstime.com/files/PTTI/PTTI_2002_CNS_Testbed.pdf
http://www.gpstime.com/files/PTTI/PTTI_2002_CNS_Testbed_VG.ppt
Anyway, this year Tom Clark presented performance results of a new GPS
board. It is h/w and s/w compatible with the Motorola M12 receiver used
in
many existing T&F products, but it's based on a uBlox-6T chip instead of
the Motorola or iLotus M12 chip. The trick is that Rick Hambly added a
PIC
on the board to make it talk exactly like an M12. The reason for this
is to
allow drop-in replacement of the original Motorola M12 or still-current
iLotus M12+ with this new one. It's called the Synergy SSR-6T.
That means that any instrument (e.g., GPSDO) that uses an M12 can be
upgraded to the uBlox-6T. Tom's presentation contains charts showing the
performance improvement:
<
http://www.cnssys.com/files/PTTI/Low_cost_GPS-based_time_and_frequency_products.
pdfhttp://www.cnssys.com/files/PTTI/Low_cost_GPS-based_time_and_frequency_products.pdf
http://www.cnssys.com/publications.php
I have one to play with and hope to duplicate his results. I didn't get
pricing/availability info but it is supposed to be "really cheap". (Tom
Clark -- can you provide this info when you get it?)
- Quartz in space
With all the focus on fiber and optical and atomic clocks, it's
refreshing
to hear now and then about good old quartz. This was a fascinating talk
about real-world (or real out-of-this-world) performance of quartz
oscillators in space. What they did was mine recorded telemetry from
many
space missions looking to directly/indirectly measure the frequency of
the
quartz oscillator over years in space.
Just like we use LH to monitor the EFC of a GPSDO, they monitor the EFC
of
the quartz LO in the GPS sats. In addition to normal drift there are
effects of radiation dose and solar flares. I'll post the URL of the
paper
when it's out. Meanwhile I saw a bunch of fine papers/presentations at
the
FEI site:
http://www.freqelec.com/tech_lit.html
- ION/PTTI 2013 in Bellevue, WA (!)
After 44 years, PTTI is changing "management". Instead of being
organized
by the US government (USNO, NASA, JPL, and DoD) it will now be run by
ION
(Institute of Navigation). This keeps the government out of the
hospitality
and conference business.
The next ION/PTTI will be held in Bellevue, WA. If you haven't
considered
attending an ION or PTTI conference before, this might be a good one to
try. Also, since that's my hometown, I plan to have an "open house"
during
the conference. That means I have a year to clean up the lab so more
than
one person can walk in it...
A number of people continued to comment on the relativity experiment I
did
a few years ago. I have now posted the original (190 page) power-point
presentation I gave at PTTI that year:
http://www.leapsecond.com/ptti2006/
- The state of Time-Nuts
Lastly, I wanted to make a note about time-nuts. I was pleasantly
surprised how many professionals already know about the time-nuts list
or
lurk here. This group has really done well. Perhaps propelled by
advances
in the telecom/optical world or neutrino experiments, there's a whole
new
crop of scientists in the precise time field. Formal technical journal
articles by PhD's tend not to deal with the mundane details of precise
time
measurement and lab equipment so people turn to google, and find us
here.
As the list grows we face some issues about posting bandwidth, focus,
and
repetition. The list is mostly unmoderated, so it's completely up to
you to
keep the list relevant and interesting. Please resist too off-topic
posts
or low-content postings. For now at least, the archived list is rich
enough
that it acts like a wiki or faq.
As usual, if you have suggestions on how to make the list better please
send them to me (tvb@LeapSecond.com) and John (jra@febo.com).
Thanks,
/tvb
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
They did respond back and I am limited to 1. Wanted 2 but such is life. :-)
Will order most likely Monday.
Regards
Paul
WB8TSL
---===
You were lucky, Paul. I have so far received no response to my query.
73,
David GM8ARV
SatSignal Software - Quality software written to your requirements
Web: http://www.satsignal.eu
Email: david-taylor@blueyonder.co.uk