Insurance for International Travel
SNIP>>>' Getting insurance may be difficult or impossible for international
travel, if the vessel is not documented. Advise your insurance company
concerning the steps you are taking to avoid problems with the lack of being a
documented vessel. Mike Maurice
As info the BoatUS policy on our state registerd vessel includes much of
British Columbia, Canada (and all of it seasonally for an extra fee) and a bit
of Mexico. Our former ACE policy (through USAA) had similar BC coverage
without a fee.
<<<gary Ritzman>>> M/V Dharma Albin 40 Mercer Island WA
I have found that getting insurance for a state registered boat to
travel from the US to 1-2 country's away from US shores as long as
the country is part of the North America Continent is not a problem.
But, place that boat on a ship, drop it into Le Harve, London,
Gibraltar, Tokyo, Hong Kong, etc and then, there is a problem.
State Registration is not recognized as a "country" registration.
And, over dinner some year+ ago, a couple of Americans touring the
Eastern med found it easier to strip all symbols of state
registration from their tenders than it was to explain this process
to the authorities at check in. (Some even when so far as to change
the name, or delete the name. But one could not do so unless he
painted over the name and symbols, and this raised undo attention at
each check in and check out because it might have been stolen.)
It has to do with the sense that somehow, a non-documented boat
cannot be "seen" as a legal liability asset, both in terms of
absolute ownership, and the ability for the authorities to hold the
boat responsible, and subsequently, its owners.
My guess is that if there was an "event," the authorities would then
seize the boat physically, and its owners / occupants, physically,
and let the courts resolve.tra
And, from direct experience, glaciers move faster than the courts...
Lee
Concerning the issue of tenders. I think that you are better off with
registration for them, than without. First, because what Lee reports is
several years old. Secondly, because it will be a problem in more places
than not, if you don't have some paperwork proving ownership of your
small boat(s). Third, if it gets stolen, you don't have any paperwork to
prove ownership.
But, Lee makes a good point that just because things are one way in 99
out of of 100 countries does not mean that that 1 in a 100 won't be
nearly upside down with the rest.
Which brings me to my contrary mind. These stories that we hear about
are often not second hand, but maybe the second 100th hand. In other
words, it's hard to know exactly what the real trouble was. It could
have been a complete abheration involving some really inexperienced
official. It could be that the official was just being contrary because
they could not hassle someone without apparent cause, so they used that
as an excuse. It could be that situation was accurately described.
I have talked to a lot folks who had problems and all the ones I have,
they had failed to do something that was expected and aggravated someone
enough to get hassled. I have been with owners who would not take my
advise and when they got hassled or delayed or charged extra, were upset
because they had been "picked on".
Which brings me to a conclusion. If you have all your paperwork
technically correct, which is not easy to do, you are a lot less liable
to get crosswise to the authorities. Most yachtsmen don't have all their
paperwork technically right, therefore you are more vulnerable to being
hassled. The reason you don't get hassled very often, is simply that the
authorities don't have a lot of incentive. But, just give them some
excuse and "pow, right in the kisser". I think you get my meaning...
Mike
Capt. Mike Maurice
Beaverton Oregon(Near Portland)
Mike Maurice mikem@yachtsdelivered.com writes:
Which brings me to a conclusion. If you have all your paperwork
technically correct, which is not easy to do, you are a lot less liable
to get crosswise to the authorities. Most yachtsmen don't have all their
paperwork technically right, therefore you are more vulnerable to being
hassled. The reason you don't get hassled very often, is simply that the
authorities don't have a lot of incentive. But, just give them some
excuse and "pow, right in the kisser". I think you get my meaning...
Mike nails this on the head.
I'll tell you a little story. In 2003 I bought Island Eagle in Seattle, but I
was planning on berthing her in Nanaimo. This would entail flying to Seattle,
whipping her into shape, and then sailing her up to Nanaimo. I had never
handled a boat this big (60 feet) and I was not familiar with the west coast,
so I hired a professional tug captain to come along.
I'll leave out the gory details (the 40 year old engine, the complete lack of
electronics, the nonexistent electrical system, and did I mention doing all
this in a 7 days). But we (my father, my uncle, my son, and myself) did get
it done and departed for Nanaimo about 4:00 AM on the 8th day. We anchored
out a Sydney Spit, and then continued on to Nanaimo the next day, arriving
about noon.
I was pretty hyper about the whole process, especially the whole importation
of the boat into Canada. I'd discussed everything with Bettina at the Canada
Customs office in Nanaimo, and carefully written everything down in my
notebook.
Step 1 was pretty simple: when we crossed into Canada, we had to call the
Customs Reporting Line and tell them we were in the country, and we had to
give the nationality and passport number of everyone on board. I did this,
although it was getting late and dark and we were poking around Sydney Spit
with no depth sounder so I was a bit distracted.
Step 2 was also pretty simple. When we reached Nanaimo we had to report to
Customs, with all of our papers, and get cleared (and of course pay taxes).
Bettina would be on duty.
Now, I travel for business, a lot. I clear Customs at the airport at least 30
or 40 times a year. I'm pretty comfortable with it. I know the drill, go up
to the desk and act polite, respectful and professional. So, when we arrived
in Nanaimo I went right to my dock, tied the boat up, got in my car, and
drove to the Customs office with the paperwork. I walked right up to the desk
and asked for Bettina.
BIG MISTAKE!!!
As I am sure you all know, when you come in by boat, you have to report to
Customs WITH THE BOAT! I had sort of missed that subtle concept. I made my
apologies and tugged my forelock, and she sent me back to my dock with strict
instructions to bring the boat to the Customs dock, with all crew, RIGHT NOW!
That's when the real fun began. My uncle had decided to take the dinghy for a
ride, so he wasn't on the boat. When we got to the Customs dock, it turned
out that I had made a mistake on my verbal declaration and given then the
wrong number for my uncles passport. And finally, my son didn't have a letter
from his mother indicating he could cross the border.
As this all unfolded you could just see Bettina getting more and more
steamed, and finally she looked right at me as she got on the radio and said
"Hey, how bout you send down those two trainees -- now would be a great time
for them to do a practice search". And the worst thing of all was that it was
totally my own fault for screwing up.
In then end, all was fine, and I even served them coffee. But she spent TWO
HOURS instructing the trainees on the fine art of searching a boat, and let
me tell you on a 60 footer there are a lot of nooks and crannies.
But I've left the best to last. In the midst of all of the screwups, the
agent said "Look, I told you clearly that you had to come to the Customs
dock". I protested that she never had, but when I opened up my notebook to
prove my point, sure enough, in my own handwriting was the note "Go to
Customs dock, past Petro Canada".
The moral to this story is pretty simple. I had all of the information needed
to avoid disaster. I should have waited to do the verbal declaration until we
were safely anchored, and that would have solved the wrong passport number.
And even though I "knew" what to do when I entered the harbour, I should have
throttled back and reviewed my notes before docking.
I was also damn lucky that I was NOT trying get get something into the
country, because then my woes would have lasted a good deal longer than 2
hours.
Scott Welch
FirstClass Product Manager
www.firstclass.com
Those who make no mistakes rarely make anything.
I apologize to the list for creating a misunderstanding.
I never intended to imply that one should NOT register your tender
with your state.
If the state requires it, then do so.
But, if there is a possibility of travel outside the US and outside
the North America continent, you may want to consider how you mark
the tender with the state's registration #.
At check-in, the two cruisers that i had dinner with last year did
not have a problem using their bill of sale to prove they owed the
tender. They had a problem trying to explain the numbering scheme on
the tender, and then when they showed the authorities their state
registration documents, they had more explaining to do. (Can you
picture trying to explain this in a language you may not speak well,
or if the authorities speak English, that they do not speak well!)
So, they ended up taking their numbers and letters off and just
showing the bill-of-sale as proof of ownership, if asked.
One cruiser had to paint over their registration, and then he said
the authorities at a port in Italy (I think Bari) really looked hard
because they thought it was stolen.
The other cruiser I think had his numbers on a board, and he just
removed the boards.
Lee
On Apr 1, 2008, at 0139, Mike Maurice wrote:
Concerning the issue of tenders. I think that you are better off with
registration for them, than without...