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Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement

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Time/freq from digital TV

MD
Magnus Danielson
Sun, Jun 14, 2009 12:41 PM

Hi Alan,

Alan Melia wrote:

Hi Magnus that may be the case in some countries I suppose. Surely the
accuracy is only required at the  end of the transmission link, the frames
from different sources are then resynchronised, and it is not "necessary" to
transmit nationwide accurately synced frames?? The UK is "privatised" and
content distribution network and transmitters are no longer owned by the
programme companies, and they probably have little say in this aspect except
that it will depend upon the price they are willing to pay.......... hence
the BBC engineer did not think it a "reliable form of frequency distribution
in the UK"....this does not mean it might not be useful!

Already in the production phase over contribution networks, avoiding
frame stores is what you want. In one example a feed across Europe
included 4 frame stores.

As for SFN networks, from the SFN adapter you want propper timing to all
receivers and SFN adapters. If you have one mux being national, that mux
needs the good timing throughout the whole national network, unless you
ignore SFN properties in some areas.

You don't framestore in the distribution phase, it's already encoded and
everything.

The flat TV screens people now have also include frame stores, causing
headaches...

I'll stick to my fatscreen a little while longer. Framestores should
only be used with care, they solve stupid problems but lowers the quality.

Anyway, the assumption that timing is being fucked up locally with DTV
is just not necesserilly correct. In the SFN world it is quite the
opposite actually.

However, the development has enabled lower and lower achieved qualities
to be accepted, while everyone has had to invest again. Great deal,
isn't it?

Cheers,
Magnus

Hi Alan, Alan Melia wrote: > Hi Magnus that may be the case in some countries I suppose. Surely the > accuracy is only required at the end of the transmission link, the frames > from different sources are then resynchronised, and it is not "necessary" to > transmit nationwide accurately synced frames?? The UK is "privatised" and > content distribution network and transmitters are no longer owned by the > programme companies, and they probably have little say in this aspect except > that it will depend upon the price they are willing to pay.......... hence > the BBC engineer did not think it a "reliable form of frequency distribution > in the UK"....this does not mean it might not be useful! > Already in the production phase over contribution networks, avoiding frame stores is what you want. In one example a feed across Europe included 4 frame stores. As for SFN networks, from the SFN adapter you want propper timing to all receivers and SFN adapters. If you have one mux being national, that mux needs the good timing throughout the whole national network, unless you ignore SFN properties in some areas. You don't framestore in the distribution phase, it's already encoded and everything. The flat TV screens people now have also include frame stores, causing headaches... I'll stick to my fatscreen a little while longer. Framestores should only be used with care, they solve stupid problems but lowers the quality. Anyway, the assumption that timing is being fucked up locally with DTV is just not necesserilly correct. In the SFN world it is quite the opposite actually. However, the development has enabled lower and lower achieved qualities to be accepted, while everyone has had to invest again. Great deal, isn't it? Cheers, Magnus
MD
Magnus Danielson
Sun, Jun 14, 2009 12:47 PM

Poul-Henning Kamp skrev:

In message 4A34DF9B.4010306@rubidium.dyndns.org, Magnus Danielson writes:

Alan Melia skrev:

Actually, this is still far from the thinking I have heard from other
sources. They essentially want everything traceable to TAI/UTC.

Make sure you ask an exact question.

For source material, they are very keen on traceability.

On the transmission side they don't care much because the network
delay these days can approach tens of seconds...

They do care for transmitters... and SFN. Actually, network based stuff
they also care... but for other reasons.

Cheers,
Magnus

Poul-Henning Kamp skrev: > In message <4A34DF9B.4010306@rubidium.dyndns.org>, Magnus Danielson writes: >> Alan Melia skrev: > >> Actually, this is still far from the thinking I have heard from other >> sources. They essentially want everything traceable to TAI/UTC. > > Make sure you ask an exact question. > > For source material, they are very keen on traceability. > > On the transmission side they don't care much because the network > delay these days can approach tens of seconds... > They do care for transmitters... and SFN. Actually, network based stuff they also care... but for other reasons. Cheers, Magnus