speed, varnished flat transom, then you will do better tied up to the
dock."

categorical defamation of a whole class of vessels (and their proud
owners) unless the words "rather than challenge the open ocean far from
shore" were added to it. The comment has the arrogance of an open-ocean
sailor with disdain for anything but hazardous living.

I say,  "Right on, Rich."  A fellow in a 16-foot skiff on Lake Superior
when that lake is in a real bad mood has WAY more of a challenge in
front of him than anyone who thinks himself an open-ocean cruiser :-)
Around here (inside waters of the PNW) we get conditions that open-ocean
cruisers seldom see, even in bad weather, and that's very closely
spaced, almost vertical-sided, wind waves.  When these get up to four
and five feet high and not much farther apart, you don't want to be out
there in any kind of smaller vessel.  These conditions have, and
continue to on occasion, capsize or pitchpole boats, "flat-transomed" or
not, even though that boat may only be a few hundred yards from shore.

The fact is that, while full-displacement boats are perfect for some
conditions, they are not perfect for all conditions.  A "condition" is
more than just what the wind and water are like.  The boater's
requirements are also a "condition."  For instance, not everyone has the
time to take a boating vacation at six knots or whatever.  In the time
they have, they'd never get where they want to go.  For these folks, the
semi-displacement (or semi-planing as I prefer to call them) boat is
ideal.  More speed but with a reasonable degree of the seakeeping
abilities of a full-displacement boat.  Other boating environments may
dictate a very shallow draft vessel, one that to an open-ocean boater or
even inside-waters boater looks "top heavy."  But in the conditions for
which that boat was designed, it may well prove a better vessel than any
other type.

As to Kevin's remark, I know a few people with boats with stand-up
engine rooms, queen-sized beds, and varnished flat(ish) transoms who
take them regularly down the west coast to Mexico, or over to Hawaii, or
up the outside waters to Alaska.  They encounter all sorts of conditions
on these trips, and so far as I know, they've never had a problem they
couldn't handle.

Obviously one wants to chose a boat that's suited for the way that boat
is going to be used.  Our 34-year-old Grand Banks is totally ill-suited
to take to Hawaii.  The windows are way too big, for one thing.  But we
have no interest whatsoever in taking a boat to Hawaii.  I grew up
there, and did a lot of sportfishing 30, 40, 50 miles off Oahu all
through the 1970s in good weather and not-so-good weather.  Most of it
in a 28-foot Uniflite.  When it comes to "open ocean" boating, I think
I've satisfied my requirement.  Our only boating interest as far as our
own boat is concerned is in cruising the inside waters between Puget
Sound and SE Alaska.  For this, a Grand Banks or similar boat is ideal.
In these waters, big windows are what you want because the scenery (when
you can see it through the fog and rain) is spectacular and sticks way
up into the sky.

To say that only one category of boat is worth having and the rest are
suitable only for tying to the dock indicates to me that the person
making the statement actually has a very limited understanding of the
incredibly wide range of boating environments and requirements.

C. Marin Faure
GB36-403 "La Perouse"
Bellingham, Washington

Sorry, But semi-anything is neither fish nor fowl, a boat with exposed prop/shafts and spade rudders and a flat wide aft underbody is a planing hull, the bow lifts when you power up, the stern resists squating., What it does not do is plane, it tries to climb its bow wave, it makes a big wake, it sucks fuel, it reduces forward visability. I met an owner in Jeckel Island recently his 43 gulfstar was reengined with twin 300hps rather than twin 120s does 25plus knots-I gave him my card-call me when you want to sell. Most semi-displacement boats are just underpowered planing boats, as for their seakeeping abilities while operating at displacement speeds in the occassional unfortunate/unplanned bad weather which you can't outrun at 12 knots-you find that you should have stayed tied up to the dock, Kevin

"Faure, Marin" marin.faure@boeing.com wrote:  >>Kevin said: If your focus is a stand up engine room , queen aft bed,
speed, varnished flat transom, then you will do better tied up to the
dock."

categorical defamation of a whole class of vessels (and their proud
owners) unless the words "rather than challenge the open ocean far from
shore" were added to it. The comment has the arrogance of an open-ocean
sailor with disdain for anything but hazardous living.

I say, "Right on, Rich." A fellow in a 16-foot skiff on Lake Superior
when that lake is in a real bad mood has WAY more of a challenge in
front of him than anyone who thinks himself an open-ocean cruiser :-)
Around here (inside waters of the PNW) we get conditions that open-ocean
cruisers seldom see, even in bad weather, and that's very closely
spaced, almost vertical-sided, wind waves. When these get up to four
and five feet high and not much farther apart, you don't want to be out
there in any kind of smaller vessel. These conditions have, and
continue to on occasion, capsize or pitchpole boats, "flat-transomed" or
not, even though that boat may only be a few hundred yards from shore.

The fact is that, while full-displacement boats are perfect for some
conditions, they are not perfect for all conditions. A "condition" is
more than just what the wind and water are like. The boater's
requirements are also a "condition." For instance, not everyone has the
time to take a boating vacation at six knots or whatever. In the time
they have, they'd never get where they want to go. For these folks, the
semi-displacement (or semi-planing as I prefer to call them) boat is
ideal. More speed but with a reasonable degree of the seakeeping
abilities of a full-displacement boat. Other boating environments may
dictate a very shallow draft vessel, one that to an open-ocean boater or
even inside-waters boater looks "top heavy." But in the conditions for
which that boat was designed, it may well prove a better vessel than any
other type.

As to Kevin's remark, I know a few people with boats with stand-up
engine rooms, queen-sized beds, and varnished flat(ish) transoms who
take them regularly down the west coast to Mexico, or over to Hawaii, or
up the outside waters to Alaska. They encounter all sorts of conditions
on these trips, and so far as I know, they've never had a problem they
couldn't handle.

Obviously one wants to chose a boat that's suited for the way that boat
is going to be used. Our 34-year-old Grand Banks is totally ill-suited
to take to Hawaii. The windows are way too big, for one thing. But we
have no interest whatsoever in taking a boat to Hawaii. I grew up
there, and did a lot of sportfishing 30, 40, 50 miles off Oahu all
through the 1970s in good weather and not-so-good weather. Most of it
in a 28-foot Uniflite. When it comes to "open ocean" boating, I think
I've satisfied my requirement. Our only boating interest as far as our
own boat is concerned is in cruising the inside waters between Puget
Sound and SE Alaska. For this, a Grand Banks or similar boat is ideal.
In these waters, big windows are what you want because the scenery (when
you can see it through the fog and rain) is spectacular and sticks way
up into the sky.

To say that only one category of boat is worth having and the rest are
suitable only for tying to the dock indicates to me that the person
making the statement actually has a very limited understanding of the
incredibly wide range of boating environments and requirements.

C. Marin Faure
GB36-403 "La Perouse"
Bellingham, Washington

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