The Coast Guard and Probable Cause
There was a recent thread on this on rec.boats.cruising which included a
link to the following article:
http://www.jcrobbins.com/documents/boarding.htm
which, I think, is an interesting and informed discussion of the subject.
Best,
Steve
Steve Dubnoff
1966 Willard Pilothouse
www.mvnereid.com
sdubnoff@circlesys.com
Being a retired police detective, I can give you the view from the other
side of the coin. When you come in contact with the U. S. Coast Guard, or
any toher law wnforcement authority. you know exactly who you're dealing
with. You can prety well determine what they may do and you can pretty much
be not afraid.(Unless you've something to hide.) They, however, don't know
you. They don't know where you came from or where you're going or what
you're doing. They don't know if you have some reason to harm or resist them
or something to hide and therefore they have to maintain a certain level of
defensive posture because they really never know what to expect.
They can and have boarded me, having been a small offshore boat operator in
southwest Florida. Not only them, but several branches of state law
enforcement and three local agencies in the Ft.Myers area. I have never had
a bad experience with any of them. They have the right to board, in spite of
any lay person's interpretation of the U.S. Constitution. They can board my
vessel every day if they want to, if it means they may possibly put some
creep bent on destruction or distribution of illegal drugs or material out
of business or better yet, in jail. Also, their safety checks protect not
only the people on the vessel being checked but anyone who may become
involved in coming to the rescue of those people. Safety checks can save
your life.
Next time you see any form of law enforcement authority approaching you,
try to remember, they don't know you.
Henry
"Wilhelmina"
On 6/25/05, Steven Dubnoff sdubnoff@circlesys.com wrote:
There was a recent thread on this on rec.boats.cruising which included a
link to the following article:
http://www.jcrobbins.com/documents/boarding.htm
which, I think, is an interesting and informed discussion of the subject.
Best,
Steve
Steve Dubnoff
1966 Willard Pilothouse
www.mvnereid.com http://www.mvnereid.com
sdubnoff@circlesys.com
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Post 9/11, forget about it. The USCG has had this authority since "rum
runner" days and like so many things human, allot depends upon your attitude
and that of the boarding officer.
Larger cutters may have a Border/Customs agent aboard whose authority
exceeds that of the USCG. So this is no time to split hairs as an amateur
constitutional lawyer. I assure you that any admiralty lawyer whose boat was
boarded would fully comply with all instructions. Henry could probably tell
us about people who kindle his interest by instinct. By the same token, it
is in our interest to make official boarders feel welcome and to put out the
right feramones. Thank Heavens I have two Golden Retrievers who do this
automatically.
At the present time, it's "not about you," it's about the situation we find
this nation in. Unfortunately, the war on terror is unlike WWII with
well-defined, heinous enemies. Unlike WWII, we are not all mentally,
emotionally, and physically committed to the effort. Besides, this "war"
will be going on for far longer than Americans have displayed a tolerance
for - we Americans like quick results and we are not going to get them.
Superfically, Afghanistan was a good, American, TV war. However, it is not
over there either - not by a long shot.
So settle back and work on being welcoming and cooperative because that's
what works for all involved in this effort.
Ron Rogers
As commented before, USCG regulations are largely based on UK 18thC Maritime
Law. HM Customs and excise can enter any premises, including private boats,
without warrents or any authority other than they are the governments excise
gatherers. You will probably find USCG have they same powers particularly
if they have an authorised Customs officer with them. Since the start of
the latest IRA troubles, ie., 35 years, HM Customs and Excise have led the
war against terrorism in British waters, any and every small craft making a
coastal transit could expect to be boarded, at sea or in the first port of
call and later ports. They are always very polite and professional and I am
glad they are on our side. One early benefit was the Drug trade was nearly
halted untill the runners found new routes, mainly by air and throught he
big containor ships. When being questioned by HM Customs it is frightening
just how much they know about us.
From: "Ron Rogers" rcrogers6@kennett.net
To: trawlers-and-trawlering@lists.samurai.com
Subject: Re: T&T: The Coast Guard and Probable Cause
Date: Sat, 25 Jun 2005 16:39:50 -0400
Post 9/11, forget about it. The USCG has had this authority since "rum
runner" days and like so many things human, allot depends upon your
attitude
and that of the boarding officer.
Larger cutters may have a Border/Customs agent aboard whose authority
exceeds that of the USCG. So this is no time to split hairs as an amateur
constitutional lawyer. I assure you that any admiralty lawyer whose boat
was
boarded would fully comply with all instructions. Henry could probably tell
us about people who kindle his interest by instinct. By the same token, it
is in our interest to make official boarders feel welcome and to put out
the
right feramones. Thank Heavens I have two Golden Retrievers who do this
automatically.
At the present time, it's "not about you," it's about the situation we find
this nation in. Unfortunately, the war on terror is unlike WWII with
well-defined, heinous enemies. Unlike WWII, we are not all mentally,
emotionally, and physically committed to the effort. Besides, this "war"
will be going on for far longer than Americans have displayed a tolerance
for - we Americans like quick results and we are not going to get them.
Superfically, Afghanistan was a good, American, TV war. However, it is not
over there either - not by a long shot.
So settle back and work on being welcoming and cooperative because that's
what works for all involved in this effort.
Ron Rogers
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As commented before, USCG regulations are largely based on UK 18thC Maritime
Law. HM Customs and excise can enter any premises, including private boats,
without warrents or any authority other than they are the governments excise
gatherers. You will probably find USCG have they same powers particularly
if they have an authorised Customs officer with them. Your coastal
protection people will have had these powers since pre War of Independence
days and will have carried them on. Since the start of the latest IRA
troubles, ie., 35 years, HM Customs and Excise have led the
war against terrorism in British waters, any and every small craft making a
coastal transit could expect to be boarded, at sea or in the first port of
call and later ports. They are always very polite and professional and I am
glad they are on our side. One early benefit was the Drug trade was nearly
halted untill the runners found new routes, mainly by air and throught he
big containor ships. When being questioned by HM Customs it is frightening
just how much they know about us.
From: "Ron Rogers" rcrogers6@kennett.net
To: trawlers-and-trawlering@lists.samurai.com
Subject: Re: T&T: The Coast Guard and Probable Cause
Date: Sat, 25 Jun 2005 16:39:50 -0400
Post 9/11, forget about it. The USCG has had this authority since "rum
runner" days and like so many things human, allot depends upon your
attitude
and that of the boarding officer.
Larger cutters may have a Border/Customs agent aboard whose authority
exceeds that of the USCG. So this is no time to split hairs as an amateur
constitutional lawyer. I assure you that any admiralty lawyer whose boat
was
boarded would fully comply with all instructions. Henry could probably tell
us about people who kindle his interest by instinct. By the same token, it
is in our interest to make official boarders feel welcome and to put out
the
right feramones. Thank Heavens I have two Golden Retrievers who do this
automatically.
At the present time, it's "not about you," it's about the situation we find
this nation in. Unfortunately, the war on terror is unlike WWII with
well-defined, heinous enemies. Unlike WWII, we are not all mentally,
emotionally, and physically committed to the effort. Besides, this "war"
will be going on for far longer than Americans have displayed a tolerance
for - we Americans like quick results and we are not going to get them.
Superfically, Afghanistan was a good, American, TV war. However, it is not
over there either - not by a long shot.
So settle back and work on being welcoming and cooperative because that's
what works for all involved in this effort.
Ron Rogers
http://lists.samurai.com/mailman/listinfo/trawlers-and-trawlering
To unsubscribe send email to
trawlers-and-trawlering-request@lists.samurai.com with the word
UNSUBSCRIBE and nothing else in the subject or body of the message.
Trawlers & Trawlering and T&T are trademarks of Water World
Productions. Unauthorized use is prohibited.