Far out. I've just read so many logical fallacies and government
conspiracies I'm embarrassed for this high quality list. Let's inject
some facts here.

I live at 43 degrees south. At the winter solstice (June 21) the sun
rises at 7:41 and sets at 16:43.

At the summer solstice (December 21) the sun rises (no DST) at 04:28
and sets at 19:49.

Sunrise at 04:28 is ridiculous. Including twilight it starts getting
light at 3:30. Switch to DST and sunrise moves to 05:28 and sets at
20:49. Much more reasonable. Nice summer evenings too.

We have DST for 6 months of the year and wouldn't swap it for anything.

I understand it's different the closer to the equator you are, but for
mid latitudes it really works.

Jim

On Tuesday, 19 July 2011, Thomas A Frank ka2cdk@cox.net wrote:

Which part embarrasses you Jim, your belief that we as adults
haven't noticed that the number of daylight hours changes with
the seasons?  Or is it the fact that this deep into the thread
you still haven't figured out what it is about?

-Chuck Harris

Jim Palfreyman wrote:

My earlier reply about flexible working practices still holds. Why not just
move with the seasons. Before clocks, I'm sure that's what we did - we got
up when it was light, and went to bed when it was dark. The bit in between
just happens to be elastic...

I live at 53 degrees North in the UK by the way.

Rob K

-----Original Message-----
From: time-nuts-bounces@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-bounces@febo.com] On
Behalf Of Jim Palfreyman
Sent: 19 July 2011 1:58 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] The future of UTC

Far out. I've just read so many logical fallacies and government
conspiracies I'm embarrassed for this high quality list. Let's inject some
facts here.

I live at 43 degrees south. At the winter solstice (June 21) the sun rises
at 7:41 and sets at 16:43.

At the summer solstice (December 21) the sun rises (no DST) at 04:28 and
sets at 19:49.

Sunrise at 04:28 is ridiculous. Including twilight it starts getting light
at 3:30. Switch to DST and sunrise moves to 05:28 and sets at 20:49. Much
more reasonable. Nice summer evenings too.

We have DST for 6 months of the year and wouldn't swap it for anything.

I understand it's different the closer to the equator you are, but for mid
latitudes it really works.

Jim

On Tuesday, 19 July 2011, Thomas A Frank ka2cdk@cox.net wrote:

that one of the backers behind extending Daylight Saving Time into the
beginning of November was the candy industry, and it all had to do with
Halloween.

candy-makers have wanted to get trick-or-treat covered by Daylight Saving,
figuring that if children have an extra hour of daylight, they'll collect
more candy. In fact, they went so far during the 1985 hearings on Daylight
Saving as to put candy pumpkins on the seat of every senator, hoping to win
a little favor.

compression of the trick or treating schedule, since all the little goblins
and ghouls wanted to go out after dark (to better scare the homeowners and
enjoy their glow in the dark costumes), but they also were expected home by
8pm (local).

time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

I live at 39° 57' 46" N and I absolutely HATE DST!  Yes, Indiana... we
haven't had DST for too long.  It's bad and I hope some day we go back to
not having it.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Kimberley" rk@timing-consultants.com
To: "'Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement'"
time-nuts@febo.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2011 1:57 PM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] The future of UTC

Mr HeathKid,

What is your reason for "hating dst". The changeover is a pain - but after
that, what is the problem?

Jim

On 22 July 2011 14:23, Heathkid heathkid@heathkid.com wrote:

Ha, you may well ask.  The reason to hate DST is given to us in the
southern parts of Australia, by our Queensland cousins:

The problems with DST is :

1. The Cows get very confused and the farmers have problems milking them.
2. The chickens don't know anymore when to lay the eggs. it is rumoured,
   that the shape of the eggs may suffer. However,
   this has not been proven, since Queensland never had DST.
   and 3.  most importantly, The extra daylight fades the curtains more,
   and as every housewife will tell you:" That will never do"

On 22/07/2011 17:19, Jim Palfreyman wrote:

Le 23/07/2011 01:39, Horst Schmidt a écrit :

Not having DST looks dangerous to mental health.  Luckily, my brother,
who lives on the west coast has regular doses of DST and should not be
affected.

The problem is: multiple users in a wide area application, where manual
reset of the "new" time is required - and some don't bother..

I have to process CCTV images from a wide range of separate, individual
organisations, over whom I have no control.
Some of them do a reset, others do not. Twice per year a lot of my time is
wasted sorting out who has gone to DST (or vice versa) and who hasn't.
Just as some users realise their system time is out by one hour, it's the
time of year to change again!
Automatic resets are the answer, but the smaller cheap-skate organisations
will not spend the money.

As soon as this illogical twice-yearly fiasco is ended, the better.
Daylight Saving Time is a misnomer anyway - it's really Daylight Shifting
Time.
If you want more daylight, get out of bed earlier. Hate DST, keep UTC
Universal.

Ron The One

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Palfreyman" jim77742@gmail.com
To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement"
time-nuts@febo.com
Sent: Friday, July 22, 2011 8:19 AM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] The future of UTC

Mr HeathKid,

What is your reason for "hating dst". The changeover is a pain - but after
that, what is the problem?

Jim

On 22 July 2011 14:23, Heathkid heathkid@heathkid.com wrote:

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To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

On Fri, 15 Jul 2011 05:57:45 +0000
"Poul-Henning Kamp" phk@phk.freebsd.dk wrote:

May i ask what the reason was to stay away from TAI?
I mean, it is obvious (for me) that for any application that needs
a steady, continious and monotone clock that TAI is one of the best
alternatives among all those time standards.

		Attila Kinali

--
Why does it take years to find the answers to
the questions one should have asked long ago?

In message 20110810074152.496cb081.attila@kinali.ch, Attila Kinali writes:

That is a very good question, the answers you get if you try to press
this point starts with handwaving and ends with "look, just don't, OK ?"

There are certainly no technical issues, so I suspect a major part
of the "ban" is simply som that the metrology community do not want
external constraints on TAI, so that they can change it to suit
their needs without political paperwork.

--
Poul-Henning Kamp      | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20
phk@FreeBSD.ORG        | TCP/IP since RFC 956
FreeBSD committer      | BSD since 4.3-tahoe
Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence.