Re: [OpenSCAD] puzzlecutlib rendering problem & STL export error Current top level object is empty.
I replied with a version that works but it is blocked for being too long.
On 29 May 2016 at 10:51, nop head nop.head@gmail.com wrote:
This repaired version seems to work. With Michael's version I got the
error message but instead of an empty object I got something that looked
like the original. I exported that and repaired it in Netfabb. That version
will then cut with Michael's test.
On 29 May 2016 at 08:36, FourthDr who_doctor@hotmail.com wrote:
Hi MichaelAtOz:
I thought about gluing the parts together, but I don't think that would
work
very will with PLA. The parts are for the Cyclone PCB Factory. Basically a
mini milling machine for PCB's and other light materials like acrylic wood
etc.. The parts are for the X axis, so they need to be solid enough for
left-right motion and to support a Dremel on top. An interlocking cut
would
make the two parts stronger than just glue. I suppose I could screw them
together. It just would have been so much more elegant to be able to make
the puzzle cut. You would think this problem comes up frequently enough
that
some of the major 3D software publishers would have a built-in solution
for
when a part is too big to print.
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It made it to the forum though.
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nophead wrote
I replied with a version that works but it is blocked for being too long.
Lets see in an Admin can fix that...
nopheads_repaired.stl
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17458/nopheads_repaired.stl
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nophead wrote
It made it to the forum though.
I just approved it, but didn't see it in the forum, but in the mailing list.
Hence above forum post, which seems to have worked.
Nophead, what version did you use to export that? (and I presume when you
say Michael's version you mean ..._fixed.stl?)
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On 29 May 2016 at 11:38, MichaelAtOz oz.at.michael@gmail.com wrote:
nophead wrote
It made it to the forum though.
I just approved it, but didn't see it in the forum, but in the mailing
list.
Hence above forum post, which seems to have worked.
Nophead, what version did you use to export that? (and I presume when you
say Michael's version you mean ..._fixed.stl?)
I used OpenScad 2015.05.16 (git e673fff).
Yes it came from your td17440_Cycl_XleftFrame-base_cut_fixed.stl. Netfabb
doesn't show any errors in that but once it has passed through OpenScad /
CGAL it shows 20 holes and 17 shells.
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Hi MichaelAtOz:
I see this attached STL actually compiles with no problems. What did you do
to the file? Or to the OpenSCAD code? Has an admin responded to your request
yet? If not, you can PM(not sure if this forum supports that) me and I'll
arrange an ftp upload if needed. Let me know. I actually will need to make
changes to my part, so having working OpenSCAD code or a work-around
procedure would be helpful. Thank you for the help :-)
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Nophead loaded that STL saying above "This repaired version seems to work.
With Michael's version [aka the ...fixed.stl] I got the error message but
instead of an empty object I got something that looked like the original. I
exported that and repaired it in Netfabb. That version will then cut with
Michael's test.".
I just loaded his STL after his post got held up, as I'm an Admin.
I just tried to reproduce what he did and can't get the same result (tho not
using his exact version). The STL still gets the error, and Netfabb doesn't
show any issues.
So sorry, not solved...
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Does the version I upload work with the original code?
I think the root problem is the old bug that OpenScad cannot import STL
files with vertices that are close together because it snaps them to a grid
and breaks the topology. Until OpenScad can import STL files properly there
will be an endless stream of these reports.
On 30 May 2016 at 22:46, MichaelAtOz oz.at.michael@gmail.com wrote:
Nophead loaded that STL saying above "This repaired version seems to work.
With Michael's version [aka the ...fixed.stl] I got the error message but
instead of an empty object I got something that looked like the original. I
exported that and repaired it in Netfabb. That version will then cut with
Michael's test.".
I just loaded his STL after his post got held up, as I'm an Admin.
I just tried to reproduce what he did and can't get the same result (tho
not
using his exact version). The STL still gets the error, and Netfabb doesn't
show any issues.
So sorry, not solved...
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nophead wrote
Does the version I upload work with the original code?
With the puzzle cut code, yes.
I think the root problem is the old bug that OpenScad cannot import STL
files with vertices that are close together because it snaps them to a
grid
and breaks the topology. Until OpenScad can import STL files properly
there
will be an endless stream of these reports.
Meshlab shows lots of self intersecting vertices. Fewer in the _fixed.stl.
But when ticking the 'unify' box on load there are none.
However, when exporting that (from meshlab), that STL still gets the CGAL
error.
With your hint, I changed it to;
module cutInTwo()
{
scale(0.5)
translate([0,-20,0])
xMaleCut()
rotate ([0,-90,90])
scale(2)
translate([55,-35,-16])
import("td17440 Cycl_XleftFrame-base_cut_fixed.stl"
, convexity=8);;
}
Which works. Seems the up scaled vertices are ok, so presumably it is the
NefPoly which has issues with the close vertices (if my vague understanding
is anywhere close). ?? clue
@ForthDr you will/may need to fiddle with the translate()'s as the scale(2)
moves the object.
The scale() change did not fix the degenerate issue, so you will need to run
the STL thru Netfabb online if you get that error.
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Hi nophead:
I took the STL (nopheads_repaired.stl) that MichaelAtOz posted for you and
plugged it into the original puzzlecutdemo2.scad using the original
puzzlecutlib.scad library and the file rendered just fine. It also exported
to stl no problems. So, what can I do to get revisions of this part to do
the same without any problems?
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FourthDr wrote
So, what can I do to get revisions of this part to do the same without any
problems?
What do you mean by 'get revisions of this part'?
Do you mean you want to do something to that STL, like add a hole or chop
off an end?
If so you can do something like;
difference()
{
translate([52.254,16.372,-9.77]) // close to origin
import("nopheads repaired.stl", convexity=8);
// -
translate([-15,40,20])
#rotate([0,90,0])
cylinder(r=2,h=20,$fn=18);
}
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17481/td17440_edit_f5.jpg
Which renders & exports;
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17481/td17440_edit_f6.jpg
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If the original STL is generated by OpenScad then you can remove the close
vertices. If you post the code I can have a look at it. If you look at the
triangulation there seem to be far too many triangles to tessellate such a
simple shape. In particular these look very suspicious.
Another solution would be to apply the puzzle cut directly to the OpenScad
object to avoid exporting it to STL and reading it back in again, which in
general doesn't work with OpenScad.
On 31 May 2016 at 07:02, MichaelAtOz oz.at.michael@gmail.com wrote:
FourthDr wrote
So, what can I do to get revisions of this part to do the same without
any
problems?
What do you mean by 'get revisions of this part'?
Do you mean you want to do something to that STL, like add a hole or chop
off an end?
If so you can do something like;
difference()
{
translate([52.254,16.372,-9.77]) // close to origin
import("nopheads repaired.stl", convexity=8);
// -
translate([-15,40,20])
#rotate([0,90,0])
cylinder(r=2,h=20,$fn=18);
}
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17481/td17440_edit_f5.jpg
Which renders & exports;
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17481/td17440_edit_f6.jpg
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Hi MichaelAtOz:
This is what I was originally doing before I got mired in OpenSCAD error
messages. I am building a milling machine. I have all but 2 of the 3D
printable parts printed. The two parts that are too big to print are already
in stl format. I was experimenting with where to cut the part to maximize
strength when rejoining the parts. So I first opened one of the stl files in
netfabb(5.1.2, since have upgraded to v7) and made a few cuts. I then opened
the stl in OpenSCAD to use the puzzlecut library. Once I had the puzzle cut
in what I thought was the right place, I tried to render and export back to
stl. Once that was done I was going to open the stl in netfabb again and
rejoin the parts. This way I would then have the puzzle cut where I needed
it. There where over hangs so that is why I was cutting first, then
puzzling, then rejoining. Here are the original stl files before any
changes:
Cycl_XleftFrame.stl
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17491/Cycl_XleftFrame.stl
Cycl_XrightFrame.stl
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17491/Cycl_XrightFrame.stl
As you can see, these parts are too long on one dimension for a 150mm^3
printing volume My idea was to puzzle the base in such a way to shorten the
object to fit while at the same time making the pieces fit together so the x
and y movement would not cause the parts to come apart.
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If you're printing in ABS, solvent welds are very strong in my
experience. I do sometimes add alignment features though, like a short
pin and hole, to make sure the bond doesn't go askew. But large ABS
prints are prone to warping if you don't have a heated building chamber.
Sometimes you can print as mirror symmetrical half parts that can be
bonded back to back to cancel out warps.
Dave
On Tue, May 31, 2016, at 11:59 AM, FourthDr wrote:
Hi MichaelAtOz:
This is what I was originally doing before I got mired in
OpenSCAD error
messages. I am building a milling machine. I have all but 2 of the 3D
printable parts printed. The two parts that are too big to print are
already
in stl format. I was experimenting with where to cut the part to
maximize
strength when rejoining the parts. So I first opened one of the
stl files
in
netfabb(5.1.2, since have upgraded to v7) and made a few cuts. I then
opened
the stl in OpenSCAD to use the puzzlecut library. Once I had
the puzzle
cut
in what I thought was the right place, I tried to render and
export back
to
stl. Once that was done I was going to open the stl in netfabb
again and
rejoin the parts. This way I would then have the puzzle cut where I
needed
it. There where over hangs so that is why I was cutting first, then
puzzling, then rejoining. Here are the original stl files before any
changes:
Cycl_XleftFrame.stl
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17491/Cycl_XleftFrame.stl
Cycl_XrightFrame.stl
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17491/Cycl_XrightFrame.stl
As you can see, these parts are too long on one dimension for a
150mm^3
printing volume My idea was to puzzle the base in such a way
to shorten
the
object to fit while at the same time making the pieces fit together so
the x
and y movement would not cause the parts to come apart.
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Hi David B. Gustavson:
I'm printing is PLA. No heated bed at the moment. That is on my to-do list.
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I can see where the crazy tessellation comes from now. There is a fan of
triangles for the simicircular cutout in the tall part that you have
removed. Netfabb is a mesh editor so it just truncates the fan of triangles
leaving some very close vertices. OpenScad can't handle close vertices.
Does it work if you puzzlecut the whole part rather than a section of it
made with Netfabb?
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FourthDr wrote
Here are the original stl files before any changes:
Unfortunately those original files have the problem. They are degenerate.
Unfortunately when run thru Netfabb online they then get the other CGAL
error. I can't see a way to fix them.
Perhaps get someone with a bigger printer to print them for you??
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Hi: MichaelAtOz:
Unfortunately I don't know anyone with a larger printer. For hire places
charge a fortune for "making". I can't afford to pay someone $100/hour to do
nothing but click File>open, then File>Print. Anyone can do that. Wish I got
paid that much for something so simple. On top of that most places also want
the file ready to go to their specs so they don't have to do any work at
all. So not worth it. Guess I'll have to work on this for a little longer.
There is one other thing I have not been able to figure out. How would I
change the puzzle cut from the default "T" shape to a round cutout? Like a
ball and socket shape. I don't see where in the code that does that.
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FourthDr wrote
There is one other thing I have not been able to figure out. How would I
change the puzzle cut from the default "T" shape to a round cutout? Like a
ball and socket shape. I don't see where in the code that does that.
The T lock is shaped by the following lines of makePuzzleStamp() in the
puzzlecutlib.scad:
translate([i,0,0])
cube ([(cutSize / 2) - kerf * 2, cutSize - kerf * 2,stampSize[2]],
center = true);
translate([i,cutSize / 2,0])
cube ([cutSize - kerf * 2,(cutSize / 2) - kerf * 2, stampSize[2]],
center = true);
To get a ball socket substitute those lines by:
translate([i,0,0]) ball_socket(cutSize, kerf, stampSize[2]);
and for a dovetail by:
translate([i,0,0]) dovetail(cutSize, kerf, stampSize[2]);
where those modules should be defined as:
module dovetail(cutSize, kerf, height) {
angle = 12;
offset = kerf*(1/2+tan(angle));
intersection(){
translate([-cutSize/2-offset, cutSize+kerf, -1])
rotate([0,0,-90+angle]) cube([cutSize2, cutSize2,
height+2]);
scale([-1,1,1])
translate([-cutSize/2-offset, cutSize+kerf, -1])
rotate([0,0,-90+angle]) cube([cutSize2, cutSize2,
height+2]);
cube([2*(cutSize+kerf), 2cutSize+kerf, 2(height+1)], center =
true);
}
}
module ball_socket(cutSize, kerf, height){
cube ([(cutSize / 2) + kerf, cutSize - kerf * 2,height+2], center
= true);
translate([0,cutSize/2,0])
cylinder(r=cutSize/2 + kerf/2, h = height+2, $fn=12, center =
true);
}
I guess dovetail is safer, stronger and easier to adjust.
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Well, I got the file manually repaired in Sketchup. It is now disgestible by
CGAL.
Cycl_XleftFrame-base_cut-repaired.stl
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17520/Cycl_XleftFrame-base_cut-repaired.stl
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17520/Cycl_XleftFrame.png
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17520/Cycl_XleftFrame2.png
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Hi Ronaldo:
Thanks. I plugged your code in and it works so far. But I'm needing to
re-slice the entire part. The base cutting was just a first draft so to
speak. I've reevaluated my original idea and that first draft will not
shorten the longest dimension of the original part. So I will see if I can
cut in a different place and still make a part that holds together. I'll
reply once I've had a chance to tinker with it.
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Hi Ronaldo:
Here is the revision I think will work for me to be able to print. Currently
I'm using the default T puzzle piece because naturally the thing won't
render and I can't clearly see the cuts with the other code. I'll want to do
this for both prints Cycl_XrightFrame.stl and Cycl_XrleftFrame.stl. Please
see attached.
Cycl_XleftFrame.stl
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17536/Cycl_XleftFrame.stl
Cycl_XrightFrame.stl
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17536/Cycl_XrightFrame.stl
puzzlecutdemo2-cut-test2.scad
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17536/puzzlecutdemo2-cut-test2.scad
puzzlecutlib.scad http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17536/puzzlecutlib.scad
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FourthDr wrote
naturally the thing won't render and I can't clearly see the cuts with the
other code.
Not sure if this is part of the problem but, add convexity=8 to you import
and it previews better.
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Hi MichaelAtOz:
I get this error when I added that code:
ERROR: Parser error in line 146: syntax error
ERROR: Compilation failed!
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Like this
import("Cycl_XleftFrame_fixed_ml.stl", convexity=8);
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Hi MichaelAtOz:
Definitely an improvement! Much more detail. It's a wonder it doesn't just
do that by default.
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Hi MichaelAtOz:
I've been searching around for something that can fix/repair SLT or the
original source format that the STL's for the mill came in. Not much luck on
the source files original format. But along the way I found an interesting
plugin for commercial CAD apps like AutoCAD and Solidworks etc. called
3dprinttech. Links below:
https://blog.adafruit.com/2014/07/31/split-large-designs-into-printable-parts/
http://labs.cctech.co.in/3dprinttech/
https://apps.autodesk.com/en/Detail/Index?id=7059401767782074929&appLang=en&os=Win32_64
Unfortunately, it is 3 years old and has not been updated. The companies
website no longer has a labs sub-domain and you can only download it from
the AutoCAD app store. I'm not going to run out and buy AutoCAD obviously
for a plugin that probably doesn't work with the latest version.
Would be neat if OpenSCAD could do that. With the exception of also being
able to create connectors other than pegs as my printer doesn't handle small
hole/pegs/pins accurately enough for that to work.
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FourthDr wrote
I'll want to do this for both prints Cycl_XrightFrame.stl and
Cycl_XrleftFrame.stl. Please see attached.
Those two files have problems too. You probably could not puzzlecut them.
Have you tried to fix them with Netfabb or Meshlab? Sketchup was not helpful
this time. I have them fixed using Meshlab AND Netfabb site Torsten linked
above. Both are free.
Cycl_XleftFrame_fixed_ML.stl
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17549/Cycl_XleftFrame_fixed_ML.stl
Cycl_XrightFrame_Sk_fixed.stl
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17549/Cycl_XrightFrame_Sk_fixed.stl
I'm using the default T puzzle piece because naturally the thing won't
render and I can't clearly see the cuts with the other code.
A change in the dovetail code could provide a larger peg.
I've been searching around for something that can fix/repair SLT or the
original source format that the STL's for the mill came in. Not much luck
on
the source files original format.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/STL_%28file_format%29
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/STL_%28file_format%29
Would be neat if OpenSCAD could do that. With the exception of also being
able to create connectors other than pegs as my printer doesn't handle
small
hole/pegs/pins accurately enough for that to work.
OpenSCAD already do that with a simple user code like puzzlecutlib.scad. No
reason to include it in the core. There is nothing fundamentally wrong with
puzzlecutlib.scad. The problems you had came from problematic stl's. For
this, there are tools out there.
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Hi Ronaldo:
Thanks for the fix. For future reference, what tools did you use to fix the
stl's? Other than netfabb/meshlab/sketchup are there any other useful
utilities you could recommend? You said yourself any one of those alone may
not find a problem or be able to fix a problem. Also, how did you actually
fix the stl files? Did you just use the automatic fix function or did you
have to go through a more elaborate repair procedure?
Now that I can actually render the files without errors, I have run into
another problem. The puzzlecutlib.scad simply slices the part in half and
places all the cuts on that one slice plain. It looks like I need some of
the cuts offset to avoid creating a thin peninsula in one area since the cut
goes the entire length of the width where I want to make a cut. Not sure if
I an explaining that clearly or not. See model.
puzzlecutdemo2-cut-test2.scad
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17562/puzzlecutdemo2-cut-test2.scad
Cycl_XrightFrame_Sk_fixed.stl
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17562/Cycl_XrightFrame_Sk_fixed.stl
puzzlecutlib.scad http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17562/puzzlecutlib.scad
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If all you need is "for a 150mm^3 printing volume"
Why not cut it like so, each is <=100mm;
http://forum.openscad.org/file/n17563/puzzlecut.jpg
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