Re Grey water and ...
How many of you dump grey water directly into the water within the 3
mile limits of both Canada and the US, including the inland waters.
Except for a very few places, it's legal to discharge gray water
directly overboard. "No diacharge" laws apply only to toilet waste.
How many of you use some kind of ecologically friendly soaps for
dishes and bathing.
It would be hard not to, 'cuz it's almost impossible--at least here in
the US--to find any dishwashing liquids, bath soaps or shampoos that
aren't environmentally friendly, whether they're specifically labeled as
such or not. People who go out of their way to buy only products that
are labeled "biodegradable" (which is a meaningless feel-good term) just
spend a lot more for products that are no more environmentally friendly
than those on the shelves at grocery and drug stores.
--
Peggie
Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and
Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"
http://shop.sailboatowners.com/books/detail-books.htm?fno=0&sku=90&cat=1304
[>>] Snip
-It would be hard not to, 'cuz it's almost impossible--at least here in
-the US--to find any dishwashing liquids, bath soaps or shampoos that
-aren't environmentally friendly, whether they're specifically labeled as
-such or not. People who go out of their way to buy only products that
-are labeled "biodegradable" (which is a meaningless feel-good term) just
-spend a lot more for products that are no more environmentally friendly
-than those on the shelves at grocery and drug stores.
-Peggie
-Peggie Hall
-Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
-Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and
-Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"
-http://shop.sailboatowners.com/books/detail-books.htm?fno=0&sku=90&cat=1304
[>>] Snip
Peggie,
We were checking the morning mail and saw this note. The Admiral and I play
a game of 'what do you think?' with TWL questions and answers to help our
learning curve.
As I read this one to Carol, she said immediately "I know that one"; and she
DID. Because we bought and read your book about six weeks ago! That's when
we gave up the Dawn patrol and went to buying the best soap buy at the
store.
By the way I also followed your counsel on cleaning the LectraSan, and that
works.
Thanks for the book and for sharing with all of us who are learning.
In our fifth month of living aboard,
Stephen Offutt & Carol Million
M/V Dutch Master
Heritage East 40
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.10.6/902 - Release Date: 7/15/2007
2:21 PM
Peggy, simply because it is legal does not make it morally or responsibly correct. I live on an island and draw my drinking water directly from the bay in front of me. We have cruisers overnite in this bay. Would you like to be drawing your drinking water from their grey water?
It is attitudes like this that are the cause of the resentment many cottagers have toward cruisers.
And that was not my question. My question was, do you do it?
Except for a very few places, it's legal to discharge gray water
directly overboard. "No diacharge" laws apply only to toilet waste.
Almost everything is biologically degradable, it just takes time. So, simply because its labeled that way does not mean it is the BEST available product for the enviroment. I am refering to the soaps that cost more because they do break down faster thus causing fewer long range problems. So, let us not bandy words about here, ok?
Do you recall how badly Lake Erie was infected with algae due to the phosphates that were in various detergents. I am not totally positive but I think you can still get those soaps today. The phosphate was responsible for the fish die off in that lake. Yes, it is lots cleaner now, but mankind can not take responsibility for that. It was the zebra mussel, and alien limpet, that was brought here in a ballast tank and has reproduced in vast numbers. Now, we are experiencing a die off of the mussel. because it has eaten itself out of house and home, so to speak. I could go on and on but I will stop here as I am sure some of the members are getting bored with this.
I have been on this island, which is on Georgian Bay, since 1960 and can recall seeing soap suds on shore following a wind storm. Granted, very little of this is grey water from trawlers, but as someone posted regarding dumping food in the Puget Sound. One less dumping means one little bit of cleaner water.
Rob Zanussi
Parry Sound, Ontario
Isabella Island B717, lot 52
How many of you use some kind of ecologically friendly soaps for
dishes and bathing.
It would be hard not to, 'cuz it's almost impossible--at least
here in
the US--to find any dishwashing liquids, bath soaps or shampoos
that
aren't environmentally friendly, whether they're specifically
labeled as
such or not. People who go out of their way to buy only products
that
are labeled "biodegradable" (which is a meaningless feel-good
term) just
spend a lot more for products that are no more environmentally
friendly
than those on the shelves at grocery and drug stores.
HELP!!. I had the unthinkable happen this weekend. I put about 5 liters
(less than 2 gallons) into one of my diesel fuel tanks. The tank is 150
gallons capacity and has about 100 gallons of diesel on hand. I have a tank
drain near the bottom of the tank. I've been told the fuel pickup is an inch
or so off the tank bottom but I would like to remove the water. I have dual
Racor 1000 filters on the tank that should, hopefully, remove the water over
time.
Is something that I can add to the tank to remove or neutralize the water?
John Esch
Fet-Esch,a 48' Chung Hwa Seamaster
Currently lying Winthrop Harbor, IL
www.Fet-Esch.com
ROBERT ZANUSSI wrote:
Peggy, simply because it is legal does not make it morally or
responsibly correct. I live on an island and draw my drinking water
directly from the bay in front of me. We have cruisers overnite in this
bay. Would you like to be drawing your drinking water from their grey water?
Weeelll...for more than 20 years, my boats were on Lake Lanier, which is
the reservoir for metro Atlanta. It is also the most used Corps of
Engineers Lake in the country. It is a "no discharge" lake, but all
boats there discharge gray water overboard, and the local sewage
treatment plants also discharge their treated waste into it. There have
been no negative effects from either...in fact, Lanier is also the
cleanest Corps lake in the country. So the answer to your question is,
not only would I not object to drawing my drinking water from it, I did
for 26 years!
It is attitudes like this that are the cause of the resentment many
cottagers have toward cruisers.
Mostly due to an emotional response to a perceived problem without proof
or even evidence that the problem actually exists.
And that was not my question. My question was, do you do it?
Yes, I did it.
Do you recall how badly Lake Erie was infected with algae due to the
phosphates that were in various detergents. I am not totally positive
but I think you can still get those soaps today.
Not in the US. The Federal Water Pollution Act of 1977 mandated that all
phosphats and other pollutants be removed from cleaning products. In
fact, even the "P" in TSP isn't real phosphate any more.
--
Peggie
Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and
Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"
http://shop.sailboatowners.com/boat_odors/
Peggy, I realize that you make a living out of telling people how to make their boats smell nice and how to look after their black and grey water tanks. And I am glad that for more than 20 years you and the metro Altanta region drank cleaned grey water. But my reason for asking was not to start a pissing contest with you over who drank more cleaned grey water. Rather it was to get an idea of how many cruiser/trawler/sailors dumped their grey water overboard without caring about the people who might be drinking it.
You did your dumping in a resouvoir which was then filtered and cleaned prior to people using it, I live in an area that draws its drinking water directly from the lake and I can not afford a water purification system like the one that supplies Atlanta and region.
Now, don't hand me this BS line about emotional reactions because I do not react that way. That is the standard fall back line used by people who just want to do what suits them best.
I am not doing to debate this any further as my point was not to start a debate, (please go back and read what I originally posted) but rather to get an idea of those who have some respect for their enviroment or the enviroment that others live in.
From your postings it is obvious which side of the line you chose to be on.
Do me and my neighbours a favour and don't ever come near Parry Sound, Ontario.
I want to thank those who have emailed me off line and been honest in how they deal with their grey water. I am thankful that you chose to be honest with me about how you handled it and I would have any of you here for a visit anytime you want.
Rob Zanussi
Author of nothing related to boating and someone who does not make a living in anything related to boating.
Weeelll...for more than 20 years, my boats were on Lake Lanier,
which is
the reservoir for metro Atlanta. It is also the most used
Corps of
Engineers Lake in the country. It is a "no discharge" lake, but
all
boats there discharge gray water overboard, and the local sewage
treatment plants also discharge their treated waste into it.
There have
been no negative effects from either...in fact, Lanier is also
the
cleanest Corps lake in the country. So the answer to your
question is,
not only would I not object to drawing my drinking water from
it, I did
for 26 years!
It is attitudes like this that are the cause of the resentment
many
cottagers have toward cruisers.
Mostly due to an emotional response to a perceived problem
without proof
or even evidence that the problem actually exists.
And that was not my question. My question was, do you do it?
Yes, I did it.
Do you recall how badly Lake Erie was infected with algae due
to the
phosphates that were in various detergents. I am not totally
positive
but I think you can still get those soaps today.
Not in the US. The Federal Water Pollution Act of 1977 mandated
that all
phosphats and other pollutants be removed from cleaning
products. In
fact, even the "P" in TSP isn't real phosphate any more.
--
Peggie
Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation
Systems and
Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"
http://shop.sailboatowners.com/boat_odors/
Evening Rob,
"hand me this BS line about emotional reactions because I do not react that
way."
Actually you just did!
And if you truly believe that the water from the bay is pure and safe even
without any human interaction, remind me never to ask you for a drink.
Giardia scares me much more than anyone's grey water.
CHeers
Mike Eedy
North Bay ON
Robert:
My parents live on Lake Ontario and drink water directly from it. When
my mother got cancer I bought them a UV water purification unit form
Lowe's. Many other places carry them too. I used to have a
campground/restaurant fed from a well and I used one to treat my water.
They are very effective and inexpensive. The reason I think this is
important is grey water is probably what should be the least of your
worries.
Right now Kingston Ontario has 3 city beaches closed due to high e-coli
counts. The blame this time is on bird droppings as these beaches are
too far away from the sewage discharge pipes.
When I lived in Toronto they used to close some of the beaches and that
was due to sewage discharge.
Grey water is probably the least of our issues and if it has Chlorine
in it it may be helping the water.
Many things contribute to pollute the water including run-off from
fields especially after the manure spreader has ran and the crops are
not up yet. People often don't think about that. Often houses on the
water have septic tanks and leech fields, I don't know if you do but if
you do where do you think that water eventually winds up?
Do me and my neighbours a favour and don't ever come near Parry
Sound, Ontario.
I think that statement to Peggie was rude and totally unnecessary. She
is stating facts and you are not.
Dave Hart
32' Island Gypsy
Lake Ontario
--- ROBERT ZANUSSI rzanussi@shaw.ca wrote:
Peggy, I realize that you make a living out of telling people how to
make their boats smell nice and how to look after their black and
grey water tanks. And I am glad that for more than 20 years you and
the metro Altanta region drank cleaned grey water. But my reason for
asking was not to start a pissing contest with you over who drank
more cleaned grey water. Rather it was to get an idea of how many
cruiser/trawler/sailors dumped their grey water overboard without
caring about the people who might be drinking it.
You did your dumping in a resouvoir which was then filtered and
cleaned prior to people using it, I live in an area that draws its
drinking water directly from the lake and I can not afford a water
purification system like the one that supplies Atlanta and region.
Now, don't hand me this BS line about emotional reactions because I
do not react that way. That is the standard fall back line used by
people who just want to do what suits them best.
I am not doing to debate this any further as my point was not to
start a debate, (please go back and read what I originally posted)
but rather to get an idea of those who have some respect for their
enviroment or the enviroment that others live in.
From your postings it is obvious which side of the line you chose to
be on.
Do me and my neighbours a favour and don't ever come near Parry
Sound, Ontario.
I want to thank those who have emailed me off line and been honest in
how they deal with their grey water. I am thankful that you chose to
be honest with me about how you handled it and I would have any of
you here for a visit anytime you want.
Rob Zanussi
Author of nothing related to boating and someone who does not make a
living in anything related to boating.
Pinpoint customers who are looking for what you sell.
http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/
Robert, you say that you do not want to start a debate, and yet you are quite clearly being confrontational, in what is obviously a debating forum.
Personally, I think that you are taking things way too far.
As others have already pointed out, land based people and businesses are providing quite enough genuine and dangerous pollution into the many water systems, so why do you have a beef with boaters and their shower sumps?
Mike
Don't be flakey. Get Yahoo! Mail for Mobile and
always stay connected to friends.
My last visit to Canada was a trip to Niagara to see the falls....a few
years ago. Gorgeous! While there we drove to Toronto and our first stop
was the beach on Lake Ontario to explore. It took all of 5 minutes to load
my kids back into the rental when we found the beach littered with medical
waste including syringes... talk about disrespecting the
environment...doesn't the wind blow south up there?:>)
I have to be honest though, I did find a cool piece of driftwood for a
souvenir.
As far as dumping anything into lakes, I especially don't think it is good
anywhere where the water has no way of renewing itself like inland lakes.
The reasoning that just because someone else is doing it, businesses etc. is
not a license for boaters to do it too.
We can all make the effort to keep the waters free of anything that didn't
originate there. Then we don't have to try to figure out how much damage it
did or didn't cause.
Bob Clinkenbeard
24' custom trailer trawler
http://home.bellsouth.net/p/PWP-aboardbobbinalong