S
SAIDJACK@aol.com
Wed, Nov 25, 2009 8:03 PM
Hi Robert,
thanks for the info. I am wondering how accurate their SNTP server with
1PPS RS-232 input is. Not sure how one would test that without specialized
equipment..
bye,
Said
In a message dated 11/25/2009 11:26:45 Pacific Standard Time,
robert8rpi@yahoo.co.uk writes:
Hi Said,
Yes it does generate IRIG B (modulated AF), I was recommended it to test a
reader and it worked fine. You can download a 30 day trial for free. The
website lists the limitations on the IRIG output. I didn't read them too
closely as they didn't affect my application.
Robert G8RPI.
Hi Robert,
thanks for the info. I am wondering how accurate their SNTP server with
1PPS RS-232 input is. Not sure how one would test that without specialized
equipment..
bye,
Said
In a message dated 11/25/2009 11:26:45 Pacific Standard Time,
robert8rpi@yahoo.co.uk writes:
Hi Said,
Yes it does generate IRIG B (modulated AF), I was recommended it to test a
reader and it worked fine. You can download a 30 day trial for free. The
website lists the limitations on the IRIG output. I didn't read them too
closely as they didn't affect my application.
Robert G8RPI.
PS
paul swed
Wed, Nov 25, 2009 8:16 PM
Sorry no idea.
It will however be offset from time if your source encodes rs232 and then
you decode it...
Easy way for everyone with a short wave receiver and scope would be to
measure the tick on 1 channel and if I recall the pulse out or you can also
look for the IRIGB leading data. As I recall its fixed and you can see it as
a pattern
But adding a server and etc I am sure its close to 1 second.
Just did not have a need to get that detailed.
I run gps connected to a pic that drives a home brew irigb gen and that
drives numbers of decoders.
The pic does several things. It extracts the time from gps and then
calculates the proper time to acount for the irigb encoder delay.
Essentially I output the next second ahead of 0 time.
Liked all of this pretty well and did essentially the same trick with a
smpte tc generator using jam sync. Works very well. I jam every 10 minutes
so that its always on time. If power fails I jam as soon as things are
stable within 10 seconds.
On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 3:03 PM, SAIDJACK@aol.com wrote:
Hi Robert,
thanks for the info. I am wondering how accurate their SNTP server with
1PPS RS-232 input is. Not sure how one would test that without specialized
equipment..
bye,
Said
In a message dated 11/25/2009 11:26:45 Pacific Standard Time,
robert8rpi@yahoo.co.uk writes:
Hi Said,
Yes it does generate IRIG B (modulated AF), I was recommended it to test a
reader and it worked fine. You can download a 30 day trial for free. The
website lists the limitations on the IRIG output. I didn't read them too
closely as they didn't affect my application.
Robert G8RPI.
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
Sorry no idea.
It will however be offset from time if your source encodes rs232 and then
you decode it...
Easy way for everyone with a short wave receiver and scope would be to
measure the tick on 1 channel and if I recall the pulse out or you can also
look for the IRIGB leading data. As I recall its fixed and you can see it as
a pattern
But adding a server and etc I am sure its close to 1 second.
Just did not have a need to get that detailed.
I run gps connected to a pic that drives a home brew irigb gen and that
drives numbers of decoders.
The pic does several things. It extracts the time from gps and then
calculates the proper time to acount for the irigb encoder delay.
Essentially I output the next second ahead of 0 time.
Liked all of this pretty well and did essentially the same trick with a
smpte tc generator using jam sync. Works very well. I jam every 10 minutes
so that its always on time. If power fails I jam as soon as things are
stable within 10 seconds.
On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 3:03 PM, <SAIDJACK@aol.com> wrote:
> Hi Robert,
>
> thanks for the info. I am wondering how accurate their SNTP server with
> 1PPS RS-232 input is. Not sure how one would test that without specialized
> equipment..
>
> bye,
> Said
>
>
> In a message dated 11/25/2009 11:26:45 Pacific Standard Time,
> robert8rpi@yahoo.co.uk writes:
>
> Hi Said,
> Yes it does generate IRIG B (modulated AF), I was recommended it to test a
> reader and it worked fine. You can download a 30 day trial for free. The
> website lists the limitations on the IRIG output. I didn't read them too
> closely as they didn't affect my application.
>
> Robert G8RPI.
>
> _______________________________________________
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
> To unsubscribe, go to
> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> and follow the instructions there.
>
HM
Hal Murray
Wed, Nov 25, 2009 8:57 PM
thanks for the info. I am wondering how accurate their SNTP server
with 1PPS RS-232 input is. Not sure how one would test that without
specialized equipment..
What sort of accuracy do you want?
You aren't going to get nanosecond accuracy out of a ntp server running over
an ethernet[1]. On the other hand, sub-ms isn't hard with a good OS and/or
good software.
It's fairly easy to get a reasonable sanity check on a (s)ntp server. Just
setup a known good ntp system and have it monitor the DUT. The reference
implementation for ntp (http://www.ntp.org/) has lots of support for
collecting data.
The key step in making a PC keep good time is tweaking the clock frequency.
This is the software equivalent of the EFC on an oscillator. ntpd calls it
drift. You can use it as a thermometer.
- There is a group working on that level of accuracy. It takes special
hardware that can put a time-stamp on a packet as it leaves or arrives.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precision_Time_Protocol
--
These are my opinions, not necessarily my employer's. I hate spam.
SAIDJACK@aol.com said:
> thanks for the info. I am wondering how accurate their SNTP server
> with 1PPS RS-232 input is. Not sure how one would test that without
> specialized equipment..
What sort of accuracy do you want?
You aren't going to get nanosecond accuracy out of a ntp server running over
an ethernet[1]. On the other hand, sub-ms isn't hard with a good OS and/or
good software.
It's fairly easy to get a reasonable sanity check on a (s)ntp server. Just
setup a known good ntp system and have it monitor the DUT. The reference
implementation for ntp (http://www.ntp.org/) has lots of support for
collecting data.
The key step in making a PC keep good time is tweaking the clock frequency.
This is the software equivalent of the EFC on an oscillator. ntpd calls it
drift. You can use it as a thermometer.
----------
1) There is a group working on that level of accuracy. It takes special
hardware that can put a time-stamp on a packet as it leaves or arrives.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precision_Time_Protocol
--
These are my opinions, not necessarily my employer's. I hate spam.
LJ
Lux, Jim (337C)
Wed, Nov 25, 2009 9:41 PM
You aren't going to get nanosecond accuracy out of a ntp server running over
an ethernet[1]. On the other hand, sub-ms isn't hard with a good OS and/or
good software.
It's fairly easy to get a reasonable sanity check on a (s)ntp server. Just
setup a known good ntp system and have it monitor the DUT. The reference
implementation for ntp (http://www.ntp.org/) has lots of support for
collecting data.
The key step in making a PC keep good time is tweaking the clock frequency.
This is the software equivalent of the EFC on an oscillator. ntpd calls it
drift. You can use it as a thermometer.
I don't think the oscillator quality in the typical PC is good enough to ever get nanoseconds, even with tons of tweaks and temperature compensation, etc. The short term variability/phase noise is too high.
Microseconds, I think you could do.
More than just a casual group. You can buy IEEE 1588 products from, among others, Symmetricom.
> You aren't going to get nanosecond accuracy out of a ntp server running over
> an ethernet[1]. On the other hand, sub-ms isn't hard with a good OS and/or
> good software.
>
> It's fairly easy to get a reasonable sanity check on a (s)ntp server. Just
> setup a known good ntp system and have it monitor the DUT. The reference
> implementation for ntp (http://www.ntp.org/) has lots of support for
> collecting data.
>
> The key step in making a PC keep good time is tweaking the clock frequency.
> This is the software equivalent of the EFC on an oscillator. ntpd calls it
> drift. You can use it as a thermometer.
I don't think the oscillator quality in the typical PC is good enough to ever get nanoseconds, even with tons of tweaks and temperature compensation, etc. The short term variability/phase noise is too high.
Microseconds, I think you could do.
>
> ----------
>
> 1) There is a group working on that level of accuracy. It takes special
> hardware that can put a time-stamp on a packet as it leaves or arrives.
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precision_Time_Protocol
>
>
More than just a casual group. You can buy IEEE 1588 products from, among others, Symmetricom.
BC
Bob Camp
Thu, Nov 26, 2009 12:53 AM
Hi
Doesn't everybody run OCXO's for the clock in their PC?
Bob
On Nov 25, 2009, at 4:41 PM, Lux, Jim (337C) wrote:
You aren't going to get nanosecond accuracy out of a ntp server running over
an ethernet[1]. On the other hand, sub-ms isn't hard with a good OS and/or
good software.
It's fairly easy to get a reasonable sanity check on a (s)ntp server. Just
setup a known good ntp system and have it monitor the DUT. The reference
implementation for ntp (http://www.ntp.org/) has lots of support for
collecting data.
The key step in making a PC keep good time is tweaking the clock frequency.
This is the software equivalent of the EFC on an oscillator. ntpd calls it
drift. You can use it as a thermometer.
I don't think the oscillator quality in the typical PC is good enough to ever get nanoseconds, even with tons of tweaks and temperature compensation, etc. The short term variability/phase noise is too high.
Microseconds, I think you could do.
Hi
Doesn't everybody run OCXO's for the clock in their PC?
Bob
On Nov 25, 2009, at 4:41 PM, Lux, Jim (337C) wrote:
>> You aren't going to get nanosecond accuracy out of a ntp server running over
>> an ethernet[1]. On the other hand, sub-ms isn't hard with a good OS and/or
>> good software.
>>
>> It's fairly easy to get a reasonable sanity check on a (s)ntp server. Just
>> setup a known good ntp system and have it monitor the DUT. The reference
>> implementation for ntp (http://www.ntp.org/) has lots of support for
>> collecting data.
>>
>> The key step in making a PC keep good time is tweaking the clock frequency.
>> This is the software equivalent of the EFC on an oscillator. ntpd calls it
>> drift. You can use it as a thermometer.
>
> I don't think the oscillator quality in the typical PC is good enough to ever get nanoseconds, even with tons of tweaks and temperature compensation, etc. The short term variability/phase noise is too high.
>
> Microseconds, I think you could do.
>
>
>
>
>>
>> ----------
>>
>> 1) There is a group working on that level of accuracy. It takes special
>> hardware that can put a time-stamp on a packet as it leaves or arrives.
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precision_Time_Protocol
>>
>>
>
> More than just a casual group. You can buy IEEE 1588 products from, among others, Symmetricom.
>
> _______________________________________________
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> and follow the instructions there.
>
BJ
Bill Janssen
Thu, Nov 26, 2009 1:33 AM
Sorry no idea.
It will however be offset from time if your source encodes rs232 and then
you decode it...
Easy way for everyone with a short wave receiver and scope would be to
measure the tick on 1 channel and if I recall the pulse out or you can also
look for the IRIGB leading data. As I recall its fixed and you can see it as
a pattern
But adding a server and etc I am sure its close to 1 second.
Just did not have a need to get that detailed.
I run gps connected to a pic that drives a home brew irigb gen and that
drives numbers of decoders.
The pic does several things. It extracts the time from gps and then
calculates the proper time to acount for the irigb encoder delay.
Essentially I output the next second ahead of 0 time.
Liked all of this pretty well and did essentially the same trick with a
smpte tc generator using jam sync. Works very well. I jam every 10 minutes
so that its always on time. If power fails I jam as soon as things are
stable within 10 seconds.
Are the PIC and irigb encoder written up any place. I have a couple of
GPS receivers and
an irig display and I would like to connect them. Been meaning to build
an irig encoder myself.
Bill K7NOM
paul swed wrote:
> Sorry no idea.
> It will however be offset from time if your source encodes rs232 and then
> you decode it...
> Easy way for everyone with a short wave receiver and scope would be to
> measure the tick on 1 channel and if I recall the pulse out or you can also
> look for the IRIGB leading data. As I recall its fixed and you can see it as
> a pattern
> But adding a server and etc I am sure its close to 1 second.
> Just did not have a need to get that detailed.
> I run gps connected to a pic that drives a home brew irigb gen and that
> drives numbers of decoders.
> The pic does several things. It extracts the time from gps and then
> calculates the proper time to acount for the irigb encoder delay.
> Essentially I output the next second ahead of 0 time.
> Liked all of this pretty well and did essentially the same trick with a
> smpte tc generator using jam sync. Works very well. I jam every 10 minutes
> so that its always on time. If power fails I jam as soon as things are
> stable within 10 seconds.
>
Are the PIC and irigb encoder written up any place. I have a couple of
GPS receivers and
an irig display and I would like to connect them. Been meaning to build
an irig encoder myself.
Bill K7NOM
JP
Jeffrey Pawlan
Thu, Nov 26, 2009 1:35 AM
On Wed, 25 Nov 2009, Bob Camp wrote:
Hi
Doesn't everybody run OCXO's for the clock in their PC?
Bob
you should make one of those text displays on the bottom of your email
that reads: my PC clock is controlled by an HP10811
That distinguishes Time-Nuts members from the general public.
On Wed, 25 Nov 2009, Bob Camp wrote:
> Hi
>
> Doesn't everybody run OCXO's for the clock in their PC?
>
> Bob
>
you should make one of those text displays on the bottom of your email
that reads: my PC clock is controlled by an HP10811
That distinguishes Time-Nuts members from the general public.
BC
Bob Camp
Thu, Nov 26, 2009 2:00 AM
Hi
Actually it's a double oven (of course that starts to bleed over to another thread). I also have a bunch of boards running with single ovens ...
I know I'm not the only one on the list doing this.
Bob
On Nov 25, 2009, at 8:35 PM, Jeffrey Pawlan wrote:
On Wed, 25 Nov 2009, Bob Camp wrote:
Hi
Doesn't everybody run OCXO's for the clock in their PC?
Bob
Hi
Actually it's a double oven (of course that starts to bleed over to another thread). I also have a bunch of boards running with single ovens ...
I *know* I'm not the only one on the list doing this.
Bob
On Nov 25, 2009, at 8:35 PM, Jeffrey Pawlan wrote:
> On Wed, 25 Nov 2009, Bob Camp wrote:
>
>> Hi
>>
>> Doesn't everybody run OCXO's for the clock in their PC?
>>
>> Bob
>>
>
> you should make one of those text displays on the bottom of your email that reads: my PC clock is controlled by an HP10811
>
>
> That distinguishes Time-Nuts members from the general public.
>
> _______________________________________________
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> and follow the instructions there.
>
RD
Robert Darlington
Thu, Nov 26, 2009 2:33 AM
I thought that was the "Starfleet Academy" or "Vulcan Science Academy"
bumper stickers we have. ;)
-Bob
On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 6:35 PM, Jeffrey Pawlan jpawlan@pawlan.com wrote:
On Wed, 25 Nov 2009, Bob Camp wrote:
Hi
Doesn't everybody run OCXO's for the clock in their PC?
Bob
I thought that was the "Starfleet Academy" or "Vulcan Science Academy"
bumper stickers we have. ;)
-Bob
On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 6:35 PM, Jeffrey Pawlan <jpawlan@pawlan.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 25 Nov 2009, Bob Camp wrote:
>
> Hi
>>
>> Doesn't everybody run OCXO's for the clock in their PC?
>>
>> Bob
>>
>>
> you should make one of those text displays on the bottom of your email that
> reads: my PC clock is controlled by an HP10811
>
>
> That distinguishes Time-Nuts members from the general public.
>
> _______________________________________________
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
> To unsubscribe, go to
> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> and follow the instructions there.
>