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Re: Enclosure for Flybridge Question

C
capdan@erols.com
Thu, Mar 2, 2000 2:33 PM

Hi, all;
Some time ago, one of our listees placed a post concerning bridge
enclosures that caught my interest, as I'm thinking of enclosing the
bridge of my Monk 36'.
Actually, the Admiral is the one who wants the enclosure. In my opinion
why spend good money to try to keep oneself away from the elements,
when I have a fully equipped lower station that does a much better job of
that?
If the weather worsens, I just go bellow to run the boat, where it's warmer,
less rocking, and my bedroom slippers stay dry, as they should be.
But no, sez the True Authority, we could entertain guests in the bridge even
when the breeze picks up in an anchorage, for example.
(personally, I'd would rather
they stay back at home, were they don't run the risk of falling though an
open hatch, or overboard, or getting sick all over my boat, but then again,
don't accuse me of being exceedingly sociable when I just feel like kicking
back)
Besides, who needs the extra "windage" when docking a single?
Anyway, our list member wrote:

My new hardtop is about finished and I'm about to have the bridge

enclosure

started.  I have a venturi windshield that goes across the front of

the

bridge and part way around the sides.  For the panels above the

windshield

I

plan to have either coated Lexan (.13-inch MR-10) or Acrylite (.08- or
.06-inch acrylic used by EZ2CY) or .06-inch Vivak (a combination of
polycarbonate and acrylic).  Elsewhere, 40-gauge clear vinyl will be

used.

What is your experience with these hard plastics and what would you

recommend?

So far, the story I've gotten is that the EZ2CY panels bend easily

around

windshield curves but are somewhat fragile and are easily cracked, and

that

the Lexan is very strong but won't bend much, so it is hard to get it

to

conform to the windshield curves (the uncoated version will bend but

it

yellows quickly).

Thanks for your help.

I contacted Jeff Smith, owner of ez2cy, who is also a member of our
club, Kent Island Yacht Club, and asked for his comments on the
product.
This is his answer:


he may want to go to our web

site at www.ez2cy.com and print out "mystery of the enclosures". This
article has information reguarding all of the currently available products
and there attributes.

to set the record straight, acrylic has more tensile strength than any of
the other products he has mentioned. when an enclosure is being utilized
tensile is what is needed. However when not in the closed position you

could

bend and break acrylic. Coated Polycarbonates are scratchresistant, but

once

you go beyond that limited resistance the scratch is forever. Un-coated
polycarbonate is very easily scratched and very subject to UV. Vivak is a
co-polyester. this product is commonly used to make soda bottles. Only the
UV treated vivak should be used in the marine enviroment and is low
teperature resistance of 140 degrees make it questionable on four sided
enclosures, paticularly in FL.

I am somewhat confused about what places he intends to use .04 vinyl. If
track is placed at the top edge of his venturi, the need for conventional
vinyl is eliminated.

If I can answer any specific questions please feel free to call or e-mail.

Sincerely,
Jeff Smith


Several members of our Club use Jeff's products, and they
seem to be very happy with them.
It may eventually be my choice for ADAGIO, but as in everything else that
represents a sizable expense, I like to do as much research as posible.
This is not en endorsement of EZ2CY. Untill a couple of days ago, I didn't
know
anything about enclosures.
Now, I'm throughly confused.

Dan Lobera

Hi, all; Some time ago, one of our listees placed a post concerning bridge enclosures that caught my interest, as I'm thinking of enclosing the bridge of my Monk 36'. Actually, the Admiral is the one who wants the enclosure. In my opinion why spend good money to try to keep oneself away from the elements, when I have a fully equipped lower station that does a much better job of that? If the weather worsens, I just go bellow to run the boat, where it's warmer, less rocking, and my bedroom slippers stay dry, as they should be. But no, sez the True Authority, we could entertain guests in the bridge even when the breeze picks up in an anchorage, for example. (personally, I'd would rather they stay back at home, were they don't run the risk of falling though an open hatch, or overboard, or getting sick all over my boat, but then again, don't accuse me of being exceedingly sociable when I just feel like kicking back) Besides, who needs the extra "windage" when docking a single? Anyway, our list member wrote: > > > My new hardtop is about finished and I'm about to have the bridge > > enclosure > > > started. I have a venturi windshield that goes across the front of the > > > bridge and part way around the sides. For the panels above the > windshield > > I > > > plan to have either coated Lexan (.13-inch MR-10) or Acrylite (.08- or > > > .06-inch acrylic used by EZ2CY) or .06-inch Vivak (a combination of > > > polycarbonate and acrylic). Elsewhere, 40-gauge clear vinyl will be > used. > > > > > > What is your experience with these hard plastics and what would you > > recommend? > > > > > > So far, the story I've gotten is that the EZ2CY panels bend easily > around > > > windshield curves but are somewhat fragile and are easily cracked, and > > that > > > the Lexan is very strong but won't bend much, so it is hard to get it to > > > conform to the windshield curves (the uncoated version will bend but it > > > yellows quickly). > > > > > > Thanks for your help. > > > > > > I contacted Jeff Smith, owner of ez2cy, who is also a member of our club, Kent Island Yacht Club, and asked for his comments on the product. This is his answer: - - - - - - - - - - - - - he may want to go to our web > site at www.ez2cy.com and print out "mystery of the enclosures". This > article has information reguarding all of the currently available products > and there attributes. > > to set the record straight, acrylic has more tensile strength than any of > the other products he has mentioned. when an enclosure is being utilized > tensile is what is needed. However when not in the closed position you could > bend and break acrylic. Coated Polycarbonates are scratchresistant, but once > you go beyond that limited resistance the scratch is forever. Un-coated > polycarbonate is very easily scratched and very subject to UV. Vivak is a > co-polyester. this product is commonly used to make soda bottles. Only the > UV treated vivak should be used in the marine enviroment and is low > teperature resistance of 140 degrees make it questionable on four sided > enclosures, paticularly in FL. > > I am somewhat confused about what places he intends to use .04 vinyl. If > track is placed at the top edge of his venturi, the need for conventional > vinyl is eliminated. > > If I can answer any specific questions please feel free to call or e-mail. > > Sincerely, > Jeff Smith - - - - - - - - - - - Several members of our Club use Jeff's products, and they seem to be very happy with them. It may eventually be my choice for ADAGIO, but as in everything else that represents a sizable expense, I like to do as much research as posible. This is not en endorsement of EZ2CY. Untill a couple of days ago, I didn't know anything about enclosures. Now, I'm throughly confused. Dan Lobera
C
capn@mortimer.com
Thu, Mar 2, 2000 8:27 PM

If the weather worsens, I just go bellow to run the boat, where it's warmer,

less rocking, and my bedroom slippers stay dry, as they should be.
But no, sez the True Authority, we could entertain guests in the bridge

even

when the breeze picks up in an anchorage, for example.
(personally, I'd would rather
they stay back at home, were they don't run the risk of falling though an
open hatch, or overboard, or getting sick all over my boat, but then

again,

don't accuse me of being exceedingly sociable when I just feel like

kicking

back)
Besides, who needs the extra "windage" when docking a single?
Anyway, our list member wrote:

Dan Lobera, right on.

Not only that the vinyl and stainless and canvas towers look bloody awful,
totally destroying the aesthetic built in by the Naval Architect (well some
of them anyway). On the other hand they do serve as a beacon of taste,
experience, and nationality which is helpful is deciding where to moor when
coming into a marina.

I have seen a few permanent installations which used a shorter (say five
foot) height and a slide hatch which looked quite at home on the host boat.
It would be tempting to build this as a permanent helm station allowing the
lower helm space to be replaced by expanded salon area.

But then if we have two engines for redundancy and safety, we also need two
helm stations, right?
Richard

If the weather worsens, I just go bellow to run the boat, where it's warmer, > less rocking, and my bedroom slippers stay dry, as they should be. > But no, sez the True Authority, we could entertain guests in the bridge even > when the breeze picks up in an anchorage, for example. > (personally, I'd would rather > they stay back at home, were they don't run the risk of falling though an > open hatch, or overboard, or getting sick all over my boat, but then again, > don't accuse me of being exceedingly sociable when I just feel like kicking > back) > Besides, who needs the extra "windage" when docking a single? > Anyway, our list member wrote: Dan Lobera, right on. Not only that the vinyl and stainless and canvas towers look bloody awful, totally destroying the aesthetic built in by the Naval Architect (well some of them anyway). On the other hand they do serve as a beacon of taste, experience, and nationality which is helpful is deciding where to moor when coming into a marina. I have seen a few permanent installations which used a shorter (say five foot) height and a slide hatch which looked quite at home on the host boat. It would be tempting to build this as a permanent helm station allowing the lower helm space to be replaced by expanded salon area. But then if we have two engines for redundancy and safety, we also need two helm stations, right? Richard
B
baumgart@starrstuff.com
Thu, Mar 2, 2000 9:09 PM

Not only that the vinyl and stainless and canvas towers look bloody awful,
totally destroying the aesthetic built in by the Naval Architect (well some
of them anyway). On the other hand they do serve as a beacon of taste,
experience, and nationality which is helpful is deciding where to moor when
coming into a marina..

I have a totally canvas and isinglass enclosed flybridge, plus a lower
station.  I have very little use for the lower station.  I only use it when
fishing and I need to move the boat 5 or 10 feet during a drift.  I agree
that the "tent" detracts from the look of the boat.  But the benefits far
outweigh the look.  All my instruments and electronics are up top, the
enclosure is warm, shady, or you can zip it open and be cool and sunny.
You can see everything so much better.  Canvas and isinglass are much
lighter than a hardtop.  A well designed one is totally waterproof.  You
are out of the sun and wind.  I think that if you have an enclosure, you
will use the flybridge all the time.  If you do not, you'll be down below
95% of the time.  Maybe 99%.

There are some drawbacks: the motion of the boat is much stronger up there,
however I only notice that when fishing a drift.  Often I am up there while
the kids and guests are below.  I am left out of the social conversation.
We installed an intercom so I can talk to them when I want to (hey - maybe
that is really a plus).  When there is a bad rainstorm, you will miss
windshield wipers.

I am sorry to hear that some people will look down on us as being tasteless
and crude, but I don't think a true cruising boat should be without as much
canvas and isinglass as it can carry.  And we are going cruising, not to a
yacht club meeting.  To each his own and one other great thing is that you
can take the whole thing down easily when the cruise is over.

As to the original post, make sure you get at least 40 mil isinglass.  30
mil is not very transparent.  I clean mine with Meguires.  Regular
isinglass scratches easily but it is cheap and easy to replace.  We do most
of the work ourselves.  You can buy everything at upholstory stores.

This is expensive!  I'll bet a complete enclosure will be $5000 to $10000.
However, the materials probably cost only $200 (not counting the stainless
steel frame).

-JimB

Jim Baumgart
<")))>><
(760)749-4257 San Diego

>Not only that the vinyl and stainless and canvas towers look bloody awful, >totally destroying the aesthetic built in by the Naval Architect (well some >of them anyway). On the other hand they do serve as a beacon of taste, >experience, and nationality which is helpful is deciding where to moor when >coming into a marina.. > I have a totally canvas and isinglass enclosed flybridge, plus a lower station. I have very little use for the lower station. I only use it when fishing and I need to move the boat 5 or 10 feet during a drift. I agree that the "tent" detracts from the look of the boat. But the benefits far outweigh the look. All my instruments and electronics are up top, the enclosure is warm, shady, or you can zip it open and be cool and sunny. You can see everything so much better. Canvas and isinglass are much lighter than a hardtop. A well designed one is totally waterproof. You are out of the sun and wind. I think that if you have an enclosure, you will use the flybridge all the time. If you do not, you'll be down below 95% of the time. Maybe 99%. There are some drawbacks: the motion of the boat is much stronger up there, however I only notice that when fishing a drift. Often I am up there while the kids and guests are below. I am left out of the social conversation. We installed an intercom so I can talk to them when I want to (hey - maybe that is really a plus). When there is a bad rainstorm, you will miss windshield wipers. I am sorry to hear that some people will look down on us as being tasteless and crude, but I don't think a true cruising boat should be without as much canvas and isinglass as it can carry. And we are going cruising, not to a yacht club meeting. To each his own and one other great thing is that you can take the whole thing down easily when the cruise is over. As to the original post, make sure you get at least 40 mil isinglass. 30 mil is not very transparent. I clean mine with Meguires. Regular isinglass scratches easily but it is cheap and easy to replace. We do most of the work ourselves. You can buy everything at upholstory stores. This is expensive! I'll bet a complete enclosure will be $5000 to $10000. However, the materials probably cost only $200 (not counting the stainless steel frame). -JimB Jim Baumgart <")))>>< (760)749-4257 San Diego
C
capn@mortimer.com
Thu, Mar 2, 2000 10:29 PM

I don't think a true cruising boat should be without as much

canvas and isinglass as it can carry...

well, there ya go!
Richard

>I don't think a true cruising boat should be without as much canvas and isinglass as it can carry... well, there ya go! Richard