Z3801A/Z3805A Adapter board
Hi All,
I own a Z3801A and a Z3805A which have the double oven 10811-60158 that have
drifted out of range and require disassembly and adjustment. So, I recently
started a project to make an adapter board to allow you to use the original
and alternate oscillators in the Z3801A/Z3805A. As some on this board have
espoused, you don't really need the outer oven for controlled environments
like our homes and labs. These boards facilitate the mounting of the bare
10811-60158, as well as adapting the 10811B. One board includes an
amplifier to accommodate alternate positive coefficient OXCOs. I have not
addressed the edge card connector in the 10811A. All boards use the
mounting holes of the 10811-60158.
I have made three versions;
- Allows the core of the double oven 10811 to be used at the basic
10811-60158 level (uses feedthrus). - Allows the 10811B to be mounted and connected (uses SMBs for the EFC
&10MHz). - Includes a versatile amplifier to amplify, invert and offset the EFC
for positive coefficient oscillators. Pads for the Oscilloquartz 8663 and
Morion MV89 and 10811-60158
One of the oversights was the oven monitor. The Z3805A would not come out
of the "oven warming" mode. The 3.5V oven monitor output mentioned in the
10811A/B manual is relative to the -12V supply, not ground. The oven supply
floats relative to the oscillator supply and output. The manual specifies
20-30V for the oven supply. The Z3805A uses a +/-12V supply. So, I used
a 9.1K resistor to -12V and the status changed. This of course leads to
other problems such as the micro chasing the oscillator frequency during
warmup. This is temporary, it eventually settles down. In my next version
I may put in a ten minute timer to allow a proper bootup and warmup
sequence.
Bob
Active adapter board for Positive coefficient OCXOs.
After about 10 hours of running, the latest round of stats. The counter
was calibrated against another GPSDO.
The initial data includes the micro making corrections before the oven was
warm (the oven monitor issue).
It will be interesting to revisit these readings after running for a week.
I hope the stats will improve after the initial turn on data expires.
Adapter board for mounting the 10811-60158 extracted from the double oven
version.
Neat -- I created an OCXO adapter board that's compatible with a range of
SRS instruments and some others, and my (purple) PCBs were made at PCBWay,
too :-)
Do you plan on making your PCBs available (e.g. as Gerbers)? The OCXOs in
my Z3805A's have not failed yet, but this would be cheap insurance.
--Andrew
Andrew E. Kalman, Ph.D.
On Tue, Dec 10, 2024 at 10:41 AM rbenward--- via time-nuts <
time-nuts@lists.febo.com> wrote:
Hi All,
I own a Z3801A and a Z3805A which have the double oven 10811-60158 that
have
drifted out of range and require disassembly and adjustment. So, I
recently
started a project to make an adapter board to allow you to use the original
and alternate oscillators in the Z3801A/Z3805A. As some on this board have
espoused, you don't really need the outer oven for controlled environments
like our homes and labs. These boards facilitate the mounting of the bare
10811-60158, as well as adapting the 10811B. One board includes an
amplifier to accommodate alternate positive coefficient OXCOs. I have not
addressed the edge card connector in the 10811A. All boards use the
mounting holes of the 10811-60158.
I have made three versions;
-
Allows the core of the double oven 10811 to be used at the basic
10811-60158 level (uses feedthrus).
-
Allows the 10811B to be mounted and connected (uses SMBs for the
EFC
&10MHz).
-
Includes a versatile amplifier to amplify, invert and offset the
EFC
for positive coefficient oscillators. Pads for the Oscilloquartz 8663 and
Morion MV89 and 10811-60158
One of the oversights was the oven monitor. The Z3805A would not come out
of the "oven warming" mode. The 3.5V oven monitor output mentioned in the
10811A/B manual is relative to the -12V supply, not ground. The oven supply
floats relative to the oscillator supply and output. The manual specifies
20-30V for the oven supply. The Z3805A uses a +/-12V supply. So, I used
a 9.1K resistor to -12V and the status changed. This of course leads to
other problems such as the micro chasing the oscillator frequency during
warmup. This is temporary, it eventually settles down. In my next version
I may put in a ten minute timer to allow a proper bootup and warmup
sequence.
Bob
Active adapter board for Positive coefficient OCXOs.
After about 10 hours of running, the latest round of stats. The counter
was calibrated against another GPSDO.
The initial data includes the micro making corrections before the oven was
warm (the oven monitor issue).
It will be interesting to revisit these readings after running for a week.
I hope the stats will improve after the initial turn on data expires.
Adapter board for mounting the 10811-60158 extracted from the double oven
version.
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I'd like to hear more about the SRS stuff you've made Andrew. I have two
SR620 one with all the options and a few PRS10.
Bill
On Tue, Dec 10, 2024, 7:05 PM Andrew Kalman via time-nuts <
time-nuts@lists.febo.com> wrote:
Neat -- I created an OCXO adapter board that's compatible with a range of
SRS instruments and some others, and my (purple) PCBs were made at PCBWay,
too :-)
Do you plan on making your PCBs available (e.g. as Gerbers)? The OCXOs in
my Z3805A's have not failed yet, but this would be cheap insurance.
--Andrew
Andrew E. Kalman, Ph.D.
On Tue, Dec 10, 2024 at 10:41 AM rbenward--- via time-nuts <
time-nuts@lists.febo.com> wrote:
Hi All,
I own a Z3801A and a Z3805A which have the double oven 10811-60158 that
have
drifted out of range and require disassembly and adjustment. So, I
recently
started a project to make an adapter board to allow you to use the
original
and alternate oscillators in the Z3801A/Z3805A. As some on this board
have
espoused, you don't really need the outer oven for controlled
environments
like our homes and labs. These boards facilitate the mounting of the
bare
10811-60158, as well as adapting the 10811B. One board includes an
amplifier to accommodate alternate positive coefficient OXCOs. I have
not
addressed the edge card connector in the 10811A. All boards use the
mounting holes of the 10811-60158.
I have made three versions;
-
Allows the core of the double oven 10811 to be used at the basic
10811-60158 level (uses feedthrus).
-
Allows the 10811B to be mounted and connected (uses SMBs for the
EFC
&10MHz).
-
Includes a versatile amplifier to amplify, invert and offset the
EFC
for positive coefficient oscillators. Pads for the Oscilloquartz 8663
and
Morion MV89 and 10811-60158
One of the oversights was the oven monitor. The Z3805A would not come
out
of the "oven warming" mode. The 3.5V oven monitor output mentioned in
the
10811A/B manual is relative to the -12V supply, not ground. The oven
supply
floats relative to the oscillator supply and output. The manual specifies
20-30V for the oven supply. The Z3805A uses a +/-12V supply. So, I
used
a 9.1K resistor to -12V and the status changed. This of course leads to
other problems such as the micro chasing the oscillator frequency during
warmup. This is temporary, it eventually settles down. In my next
version
I may put in a ten minute timer to allow a proper bootup and warmup
sequence.
Bob
Active adapter board for Positive coefficient OCXOs.
After about 10 hours of running, the latest round of stats. The counter
was calibrated against another GPSDO.
The initial data includes the micro making corrections before the oven
was
warm (the oven monitor issue).
It will be interesting to revisit these readings after running for a
week.
I hope the stats will improve after the initial turn on data expires.
Adapter board for mounting the 10811-60158 extracted from the double oven
version.
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Hi All.
Attached is my document on the OCXOs I made. This was in response to one of
my XL Microwave frequency counters not having the nice BIG IsoTemp OCXO
that you find in SRS SR620s and similar units. I ended up also using my
little OCXO in SRS DS345 waveform generators.
Anway, this was my first attempt at putting some care into engineering an
OCXO module for an instrument. My writeup (without the tons of 3rd-party
datasheets, etc. that make it 6MB large) is attached.
Comments / criticisms welcome.
--Andrew
Andrew E. Kalman, Ph.D.
On Tue, Dec 10, 2024 at 7:40 PM Bill Notfaded notfaded1@gmail.com wrote:
I'd like to hear more about the SRS stuff you've made Andrew. I have two
SR620 one with all the options and a few PRS10.
Bill
On Tue, Dec 10, 2024, 7:05 PM Andrew Kalman via time-nuts <
time-nuts@lists.febo.com> wrote:
Neat -- I created an OCXO adapter board that's compatible with a range of
SRS instruments and some others, and my (purple) PCBs were made at PCBWay,
too :-)
Do you plan on making your PCBs available (e.g. as Gerbers)? The OCXOs in
my Z3805A's have not failed yet, but this would be cheap insurance.
--Andrew
Andrew E. Kalman, Ph.D.
On Tue, Dec 10, 2024 at 10:41 AM rbenward--- via time-nuts <
time-nuts@lists.febo.com> wrote:
Hi All,
I own a Z3801A and a Z3805A which have the double oven 10811-60158 that
have
drifted out of range and require disassembly and adjustment. So, I
recently
started a project to make an adapter board to allow you to use the
original
and alternate oscillators in the Z3801A/Z3805A. As some on this board
have
espoused, you don't really need the outer oven for controlled
environments
like our homes and labs. These boards facilitate the mounting of the
bare
10811-60158, as well as adapting the 10811B. One board includes an
amplifier to accommodate alternate positive coefficient OXCOs. I have
not
addressed the edge card connector in the 10811A. All boards use the
mounting holes of the 10811-60158.
I have made three versions;
-
Allows the core of the double oven 10811 to be used at the basic
10811-60158 level (uses feedthrus).
-
Allows the 10811B to be mounted and connected (uses SMBs for the
EFC
&10MHz).
-
Includes a versatile amplifier to amplify, invert and offset the
EFC
for positive coefficient oscillators. Pads for the Oscilloquartz 8663
and
Morion MV89 and 10811-60158
One of the oversights was the oven monitor. The Z3805A would not come
out
of the "oven warming" mode. The 3.5V oven monitor output mentioned in
the
10811A/B manual is relative to the -12V supply, not ground. The oven
supply
floats relative to the oscillator supply and output. The manual
specifies
20-30V for the oven supply. The Z3805A uses a +/-12V supply. So, I
used
a 9.1K resistor to -12V and the status changed. This of course leads to
other problems such as the micro chasing the oscillator frequency during
warmup. This is temporary, it eventually settles down. In my next
version
I may put in a ten minute timer to allow a proper bootup and warmup
sequence.
Bob
Active adapter board for Positive coefficient OCXOs.
After about 10 hours of running, the latest round of stats. The
counter
was calibrated against another GPSDO.
The initial data includes the micro making corrections before the oven
was
warm (the oven monitor issue).
It will be interesting to revisit these readings after running for a
week.
I hope the stats will improve after the initial turn on data expires.
Adapter board for mounting the 10811-60158 extracted from the double
oven
version.
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To unsubscribe send an email to time-nuts-leave@lists.febo.com
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Hi Andrew,
I have several extra boards built up already. There is a price point in buying assembled boards, so I have a few extra.
The passive board for the feedthrough version of the 10811 is working fine, although I am not sure the 10811 itself is in great shape. I think it’s at the end of its adjustment range.
The active board is also working with a Oscilloquartz 8663. Once I fudged the oven monitor signal it comes up fine after an hour or so. It boots up with “warm” oven because of the fudged signal so it is erratic in the beginning but it eventually settles down. The active board is nice because you don’t need to dismantle your 10811-60158 to get the core 10811 out of it.
I am now working on a slight variation, removing the 10811 from the active version and replacing it with a ISOTEMP 134-10. I added an amplifier to invert the oven monitor signal.
Andrew, did you design that board or did you purchase and build it?
Bob
From: Andrew Kalman aekalman@gmail.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2024 9:00 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@lists.febo.com
Cc: rbenward@verizon.net
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Z3801A/Z3805A Adapter board
Neat -- I created an OCXO adapter board that's compatible with a range of SRS instruments and some others, and my (purple) PCBs were made at PCBWay, too :-)
Do you plan on making your PCBs available (e.g. as Gerbers)? The OCXOs in my Z3805A's have not failed yet, but this would be cheap insurance.
--Andrew
Andrew E. Kalman, Ph.D.
On Tue, Dec 10, 2024 at 10:41 AM rbenward--- via time-nuts <time-nuts@lists.febo.com mailto:time-nuts@lists.febo.com > wrote:
Hi All,
I own a Z3801A and a Z3805A which have the double oven 10811-60158 that have
drifted out of range and require disassembly and adjustment. So, I recently
started a project to make an adapter board to allow you to use the original
and alternate oscillators in the Z3801A/Z3805A. As some on this board have
espoused, you don't really need the outer oven for controlled environments
like our homes and labs. These boards facilitate the mounting of the bare
10811-60158, as well as adapting the 10811B. One board includes an
amplifier to accommodate alternate positive coefficient OXCOs. I have not
addressed the edge card connector in the 10811A. All boards use the
mounting holes of the 10811-60158.
I have made three versions;
-
Allows the core of the double oven 10811 to be used at the basic
10811-60158 level (uses feedthrus).
-
Allows the 10811B to be mounted and connected (uses SMBs for the EFC
&10MHz).
-
Includes a versatile amplifier to amplify, invert and offset the EFC
for positive coefficient oscillators. Pads for the Oscilloquartz 8663 and
Morion MV89 and 10811-60158
One of the oversights was the oven monitor. The Z3805A would not come out
of the "oven warming" mode. The 3.5V oven monitor output mentioned in the
10811A/B manual is relative to the -12V supply, not ground. The oven supply
floats relative to the oscillator supply and output. The manual specifies
20-30V for the oven supply. The Z3805A uses a +/-12V supply. So, I used
a 9.1K resistor to -12V and the status changed. This of course leads to
other problems such as the micro chasing the oscillator frequency during
warmup. This is temporary, it eventually settles down. In my next version
I may put in a ten minute timer to allow a proper bootup and warmup
sequence.
Bob
Active adapter board for Positive coefficient OCXOs.
After about 10 hours of running, the latest round of stats. The counter
was calibrated against another GPSDO.
The initial data includes the micro making corrections before the oven was
warm (the oven monitor issue).
It will be interesting to revisit these readings after running for a week.
I hope the stats will improve after the initial turn on data expires.
Adapter board for mounting the 10811-60158 extracted from the double oven
version.
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To unsubscribe send an email to time-nuts-leave@lists.febo.com mailto:time-nuts-leave@lists.febo.com
Hi Bob.
As per the UM-20 document, David and I at Pumpkin designed and built the
little OCXO board. It was our first (and to date, only) foray into choosing
particular parts (the resistors and potentiometer) with specifically low
tempcos.
--Andrew
Andrew E. Kalman, Ph.D.
On Sat, Dec 14, 2024 at 7:28 AM rbenward@verizon.net wrote:
Hi Andrew,
I have several extra boards built up already. There is a price point in
buying assembled boards, so I have a few extra.
The passive board for the feedthrough version of the 10811 is working
fine, although I am not sure the 10811 itself is in great shape. I think
it’s at the end of its adjustment range.
The active board is also working with a Oscilloquartz 8663. Once I fudged
the oven monitor signal it comes up fine after an hour or so. It boots up
with “warm” oven because of the fudged signal so it is erratic in the
beginning but it eventually settles down. The active board is nice because
you don’t need to dismantle your 10811-60158 to get the core 10811 out of
it.
I am now working on a slight variation, removing the 10811 from the active
version and replacing it with a ISOTEMP 134-10. I added an amplifier to
invert the oven monitor signal.
Andrew, did you design that board or did you purchase and build it?
Bob
From: Andrew Kalman aekalman@gmail.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2024 9:00 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement <
time-nuts@lists.febo.com>
Cc: rbenward@verizon.net
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Z3801A/Z3805A Adapter board
Neat -- I created an OCXO adapter board that's compatible with a range of
SRS instruments and some others, and my (purple) PCBs were made at PCBWay,
too :-)
Do you plan on making your PCBs available (e.g. as Gerbers)? The OCXOs in
my Z3805A's have not failed yet, but this would be cheap insurance.
--Andrew
Andrew E. Kalman, Ph.D.
On Tue, Dec 10, 2024 at 10:41 AM rbenward--- via time-nuts <
time-nuts@lists.febo.com> wrote:
Hi All,
I own a Z3801A and a Z3805A which have the double oven 10811-60158 that
have
drifted out of range and require disassembly and adjustment. So, I
recently
started a project to make an adapter board to allow you to use the original
and alternate oscillators in the Z3801A/Z3805A. As some on this board have
espoused, you don't really need the outer oven for controlled environments
like our homes and labs. These boards facilitate the mounting of the bare
10811-60158, as well as adapting the 10811B. One board includes an
amplifier to accommodate alternate positive coefficient OXCOs. I have not
addressed the edge card connector in the 10811A. All boards use the
mounting holes of the 10811-60158.
I have made three versions;
-
Allows the core of the double oven 10811 to be used at the basic
10811-60158 level (uses feedthrus).
-
Allows the 10811B to be mounted and connected (uses SMBs for the
EFC
&10MHz).
-
Includes a versatile amplifier to amplify, invert and offset the
EFC
for positive coefficient oscillators. Pads for the Oscilloquartz 8663 and
Morion MV89 and 10811-60158
One of the oversights was the oven monitor. The Z3805A would not come out
of the "oven warming" mode. The 3.5V oven monitor output mentioned in the
10811A/B manual is relative to the -12V supply, not ground. The oven supply
floats relative to the oscillator supply and output. The manual specifies
20-30V for the oven supply. The Z3805A uses a +/-12V supply. So, I used
a 9.1K resistor to -12V and the status changed. This of course leads to
other problems such as the micro chasing the oscillator frequency during
warmup. This is temporary, it eventually settles down. In my next version
I may put in a ten minute timer to allow a proper bootup and warmup
sequence.
Bob
Active adapter board for Positive coefficient OCXOs.
After about 10 hours of running, the latest round of stats. The counter
was calibrated against another GPSDO.
The initial data includes the micro making corrections before the oven was
warm (the oven monitor issue).
It will be interesting to revisit these readings after running for a week.
I hope the stats will improve after the initial turn on data expires.
Adapter board for mounting the 10811-60158 extracted from the double oven
version.
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