jfor@quikus.com said:

What is the bandwidth of the transmitted signal?

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less then 10 hz and more like 1

On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 1:15 PM, Hal Murray hmurray@megapathdsl.net wrote:

The bandwidth is secondary. The time-domain response of the filter is the
issue.

-John

=============

Hi

I suspect the bandwidth is > 1 Hz, since they want to get the data bits to
reliably flip within a second. I'm sure the bandwidth is limited for a
number of reasons.

Bob

-----Original Message-----
From: time-nuts-bounces@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-bounces@febo.com] On
Behalf Of paul swed
Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2012 1:57 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] WWVB Response

less then 10 hz and more like 1

On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 1:15 PM, Hal Murray hmurray@megapathdsl.net wrote:

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In this area, you cannot get the BW down enough for a usable signal
without killing the time response to the BPSK transitions.

YMMV,

-John

================

HI

Wasn't the original question about the transmitted bandwidth? If not, then I answered the wrong question.

I am indeed very interested in what the transmitted bandwidth actually is.

Bob

On Sep 27, 2012, at 2:48 PM, J. Forster jfor@quikus.com wrote:

On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 11:16:45AM -0700, J. Forster wrote:

Seems clear that you need a reasonably wide preselection filter

to avoid this problem, maybe as someone suggests several hundred or more
hz to really kill serious phase trajectory problems.

BUT this does not imply anything but that the dynamic range and

noise properties of the signal processing that deals with that bandwidth
must be able to handle all the energy there.  And yes, with a wider
bandwidth there WILL be more noise and crud at the output of the RF
preselection.  But not so much as to make a quadrature multipliers
(mixers) for a Costas loop unimplementable.

The actual tracking or detection bandwidth can - however- be

made arbitrarily small using a standard - known for 70 years - Costas
loop - and is a function of the LPF characteristics in the Q arm...
and of course the drift and random noise (eg Adev) characteristics
of the VCO (and signal and propagation).

Since both the local loop VCO and the WWVB carrier are assumed

to be from reasonably high quality stable sources and propagation is not
expected to be wildly variable this bandwidth in locked mode can be made
almost arbitrarily small... hundredths of a  Hz or less...

And THAT bandwidth is the true noise bandwidth.

The only real issue in such an approach is locking the loop in

the first place... it will be necessary to start with the VCO close to
the carrier or widen the loop bandwidth initially in search mode.  In
the digital or data domain of course FFTs help here a lot.

--
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