In reply to Arild's comment:
"It is my understanding that many marinas already have restrictions on
operating
gensets inside the marina.
Same goes for  some marine parks.  This is another trend that is likely to
spread.  At the very least you will have  limited  hours of operation.
Now rapid charge becomes  important if not critical. "

If there were a power failure I honestly think it would be unlikely that
marinas would enforce any ban they may have on generators. Generally speaking
it seems unlikely that our average sized trawler would want to run a generator
at a dock anyway. And as someone pointed out, it seems highly complicated to
my humble mind to have a DC generator as long as shore power is 110/220.

Further 24V adds yet another inconvenient factor to the equation. Yes I know
it is popular on larger vessels and rightly so, but aside from the aero
industry, bulbs and fittings are not readily available in one's local
chandlery. I had a sailboat once with a 32V system (4 big Surrette 8V.s). I
had to keep a stock of spares on board all the time. Yes it was more efficient

• the wiring to the windlass alone was much much smaller, but it was a
  constant parts headache. Now maybe if all the auto industry goes to 12V things
  will be very easy.

Ron Barr
Lady Brookhaven Hatteras LRC 42

Ron said: >>Now maybe if all the auto industry goes to 12V things will be
very easy.<<

Hi Ron.
I think that the auto industry is moving towards a higher voltage system,
but I can't remember exactly what.
I'm sure Arild will know.
Cheers
Glenn

Actually I meant to say 24V!
Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: Glenn Williams
To: ronald barr ; trawler-world-list@samurai.com
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2003 2:30 AM
Subject: Re: Generators DC v. AC

Ron said: >>Now maybe if all the auto industry goes to 12V things will be
very easy.<<

Hi Ron.
I think that the auto industry is moving towards a higher voltage system,
but I can't remember exactly what.
I'm sure Arild will know.
Cheers
Glenn

In support of Ron's comments, the mid to low size range of the
recreational vessel industry is strongly tied to whatever voltage is
current in the automotive industry for dc applications, and strongly
tied to whatever voltage is current in the major home applications for
ac applications.  If these major market segments swing to other
voltages, then we will see the smaller markets follow.

--
Nick Meloy
44' Custom Trawler  "Serendipity"
mulatfl@att.net  30 32.855 N  87 07.550 W
(850) 994-6165

Nick Meloy wrote, "In support of Ron's comments, the mid to low size
range of the recreational vessel industry is strongly tied to whatever
voltage is current in the automotive industry for dc applications, and
strongly tied to whatever voltage is current in the major home
applications for ac applications.  If these major market segments swing
to other voltages, then we will see the smaller markets follow."

Since the Military has been using a 24 - 28 volt standard (24 at the
battery, 28 at the alternator) for quite some time there is a wide
selection of components and subsystems available for the 24 volt
standard. For the few 12 volt items that are not available in 24 volt,
you can get DC-DC converters. For example: Powerstream has several
options listed at http://www.powerstream.com/Produz10.htm . The smallest
size provides 10 amp (max output) or up to 138 Watts at 13.8 volts at a
cost of $30.75. The next size up, 15 amp provides 207 watts and costs
$50.25. The largest size, 80 amp, provides 1,112 watts and costs
$172.50. Since switching to 24 volts would save more in wiring cost than
the cost of a DC-DC converter, I think the availability of 24 volt
components is not an issue.

Once the automotive industry makes the switch to 36-48 volts and
alternators, batteries, etc. become economically available you can make
the switch by changing the DC-DC converter to a 36 to 12 volt model. In
addition, you can add a 36 to 24 volt converter so you don't have to
replace every 24 volt system when you make the switch.

Regards;
Mike Schooley

Mike Schooley  wrote:
Once the automotive industry makes the switch to 36-48 volts and
alternators, batteries, etc. become economically available you can make
the switch by changing the DC-DC converter to a 36 to 12 volt model. In
addition, you can add a 36 to 24 volt converter so you don't have to
replace every 24 volt system when you make the switch.

REPLY

When we repowered a large fishing trawler , all the Furuno  navigation gear was
wide input capable.
In other words the switch mode power supply could take any voltage from 10 - 40
volts

The only difference  was the fuse size. As the voltage drops the current
increases to  yield the same power.

Next time you are looking at  new  electronic equipment see if this choice is
available to you.
That sure makes  a later conversion easier down the road  (or canal )

regards
Arild

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Well here is one  case where a radar would not have helped. < grin>
Arild

Seattle October 11, 2003 - The U.S. Coast Guard Marine Safety Office Puget
Sound monitored the retrieval of an empty oil barge after the towing line
connecting it to a tugboat separated.
At approximately 2 p.m. the Coast Guard Vessel Traffic Service Puget Sound
received notification that the oil barge Dottie was separated from its tugboat
the Ernest Campbell.  >>> snip<<<
The cause of the incident is under investigation by the Coast Guard Marine
Safety Office Puget Sound.

Saturday, October 11, 2003 7 Last updated 6:29 p.m. PT

Submarine severs tug boat's tow line

THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

PORT ANGELES, Wash. -- A nuclear submarine performing routine exercises
off Cape Flattery severed the tow line between a tugboat and an empty
oil barge Saturday afternoon, leaving the barge drifting in 16- to
18-foot swells.

Navy spokeswoman Lt. Barbara Mertz confirmed the accident Saturday
afternoon but would not say how it happened.

"It's under investigation," she said.

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